Harlequin's Crest dropped from Duriel tonight. Was somewhat concerned since my off meta build relied on the Starfall Coronet's cooldown provisions to drive barrier generation for my Sorcerer, but +4 to all skills really gains you ground in surprising way, and it was not like I was not going to wear the Harlequin's Crest.
The Diablo IV thread
- Thread starter skazz
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Heartseeker Rogue at lvl 90 when I logged off last night. Let me tell you, getting the right tempers on the gear for this build is way more of a pain in the ass then the Necro or Barb were. Yeah I'm still leveling, but ilvl925 gear has been dropping for a minute now at that level. Aside from that, build is a ton of fun. One of the rings I "bricked" ended up with Lucky HIt causes Vulnerability. Most things are either frozen, vulnerable, or both, and then they just explode 
As someone new to D4 but played a ton of pretty much every ARPG going back to Diablo, the temper system does not feel good. I understand their desire to differentiate it from enchanting but not even being able to keep the existing temper makes it feel really bad. I have played thousands of hours in PoE and it has a currency called exalts that add a new mod to your equipment, so kind of similar to tempering. Doing it "blind" is called exalt slamming and the thing is, almost no one just slams an exalt on a piece of equipment that they are trying to craft for endgame. They use things that limit the risk of a bad result (like blocking certain results) and for really expensive end-endgame stuff, spend other resources to allow a rollback (like imprinting). And absolute worst case, there is a YOLO currency that removes a mod in case you got a really bad result that might brick the item but might just allow you to try again.
I know the crafting methods are not directly comparable and there's definitely the possibility of having to start from scratch having wasted a ton of resources in PoE but it certainly feels better in the majority of cases compared to tempering.
I know the crafting methods are not directly comparable and there's definitely the possibility of having to start from scratch having wasted a ton of resources in PoE but it certainly feels better in the majority of cases compared to tempering.
The psychological way to avoid this is "a GA item is simply the potential for something in the future, you haven't lucked into anything yet". And then "A GA item with successful tempers is a great new item, congratulations".
i.e. Tempering is simply adding attributes post-drop but still part of the initial item creation phase, not the upgrading phase.
Sure, that 2 or 3 GA item is probably going to fail tempering, but 0 or 1 GA items with the right stats in all slots is easy. It's kind of the same as a Perfect Ancient in Diablo 3: You could get a perfect item to drop, but if more than 1 affix was the wrong one it was still totally worthless.
Anyway, if you don't think of it this way, you'll probably want to quit playing after your 3rd 2/3GA brick
i.e. Tempering is simply adding attributes post-drop but still part of the initial item creation phase, not the upgrading phase.
Sure, that 2 or 3 GA item is probably going to fail tempering, but 0 or 1 GA items with the right stats in all slots is easy. It's kind of the same as a Perfect Ancient in Diablo 3: You could get a perfect item to drop, but if more than 1 affix was the wrong one it was still totally worthless.
Anyway, if you don't think of it this way, you'll probably want to quit playing after your 3rd 2/3GA brick
They definitely need to bring in something that either blocks a specific attribute or adds + to % roll on a specific attribute. The amount of misses is ridiculous in the current system.
I do like the idea of regrouping each of the tempers so there are no more than 3 per group and adding one roll for every GA the object has. Another idea - resetting the masterworking from 12 for an item gives you the option to remove the temper at the same time.
Given that Blizzard was very cautious with their proposed S5 changes to tempering, it's clear that they want an endgame where players have to struggle to get "perfect" gear. Aspects are now almost effortless to perfect, Masterworking can be reset as many times as you like as can enchanting. Only tempering is a permanent loss, and that won't change in S5's current plan.
The way I see it, tempering GA items is the real endgame for players who put many hundreds of hours into the game. If Blizzard made it easy to reset tempers, what would the endgame itemisation be? Players would "complete" their gear well before season end...
The way I see it, tempering GA items is the real endgame for players who put many hundreds of hours into the game. If Blizzard made it easy to reset tempers, what would the endgame itemisation be? Players would "complete" their gear well before season end...
If tempering is going to remain with a limit, then at least increase the drop rate of 2/3 GA items at some point (maybe in higher tier pits or some other similar activity). It wouldn't feel so bad if you could reasonably expect to get more in the future, but right now good 2/3 GA items are difficult to get.
The grouping plan they have could help. I guess we'll see starting tomorrow. Glad I don't have to redownload the PTR stuff again, and that it's going to be up a bit longer than the last one. Isn't it? I cannot remember .
I get not wanting to allow us to get perfect items right out of the gate after hitting level 100, but the amount of gear that I have bricked, I should honestly start saving it just to have a count, has really started to get out hand. I am looking at you Cutthroat tempers!
.I get not wanting to allow us to get perfect items right out of the gate after hitting level 100, but the amount of gear that I have bricked, I should honestly start saving it just to have a count, has really started to get out hand. I am looking at you Cutthroat tempers!
"Hi human, to be happy, pretend to not be human!"
Even if it works for those people, they're a pretty small fraction of the playerbase, and for the rest of us the current tempering system feels like shit. Too many temper results aren't suboptimal, they're effectively empty slots. The more important a temper is to a build, the more likely it is to be part of a manual where the other possibilities are empty slots.
There should be something for the hundreds of hours players to chase, but it shouldn't be at the expense of the dozens of hours players. The fix for tempering isn't resetting, it's removing build-specific stuff from the tempering RNG. You can do this by removing build-specific stuff from tempering (I proposed this on the last page, by moving those affixes to gems), or by removing the RNG from tempering when you're dealing with those affixes (change some manuals, mostly weapon manuals, to a single result with a power range, like changing rogue's Core Augments from five options to only "+X% chance for Core abilities to cast twice").
Right now, 2/3 GA items at all are difficult to get if you aren't playing dozens of hours per week. Good 2/3 GA items are not far off from Uber Uniques.
There's a reason Blizzard made all Uber Uniques drop with a fixed set of stats instead of RNG stats. They appear to have forgotten why when they decided on the RNG balance for the GA system.
They also said in the fireside chat that they want players chasing and building around uniques in S5. So it could be as simple as "tempering is only going to be half as important next season, so don't go hog-wild changing it".
A little light reading before the PTR opens up tomorrow:
I was going to continue playing the Hearseeker build for a few more days before changing over to the PTR, but now I think I might switch over and level a Flurry Rogue.
I was going to continue playing the Hearseeker build for a few more days before changing over to the PTR, but now I think I might switch over and level a Flurry Rogue.
So hardcore is getting VERY annoying.
My Thorns barb? At L91, I'm fighting the Helltide Queen, and I'm full health (in fact I never would dip in that fight, did it dozens of times) and suddenly I just splat. I wasn't anywhere near the fire ring (it was on the opposite side of the screen from me) and I had challenging shout up at the time. Just splat. No idea what caused it.
Had a very promising golem minion necro. Got into the 70s, was running a NM 41 (electric - picked the affix because my resistances were all in the 60s, had been running NM41 for some time because they were safe), had bonestorm up, suddenly splat, instant ghost. Some elite teleported on top of me, then insta-evaded back to it's spot, and that was apparently enough to take me to zero from full.
Yay me.
My Thorns barb? At L91, I'm fighting the Helltide Queen, and I'm full health (in fact I never would dip in that fight, did it dozens of times) and suddenly I just splat. I wasn't anywhere near the fire ring (it was on the opposite side of the screen from me) and I had challenging shout up at the time. Just splat. No idea what caused it.
Had a very promising golem minion necro. Got into the 70s, was running a NM 41 (electric - picked the affix because my resistances were all in the 60s, had been running NM41 for some time because they were safe), had bonestorm up, suddenly splat, instant ghost. Some elite teleported on top of me, then insta-evaded back to it's spot, and that was apparently enough to take me to zero from full.
Yay me.
So I'd like to ask all the experienced folks here: I just started D4 (XBox Game Pass) with completely fresh eyes. I've only played 2 so everything is a little overwhelming. I honestly just want to play and have fun and not really dump any money into it.
Is there anything really obvious that I should be doing from a noob standpoint that has probably flown over my head? Or do I just play?
Is there anything really obvious that I should be doing from a noob standpoint that has probably flown over my head? Or do I just play?
You just play. If you can, select to start your character as a seasonal character. But then just run through the campaign mode.
And don't worry about investing money. The only thing in the shop is cosmetics and the upcoming expansion - there's nothing that impacts the actual gameplay.
Yep, just start by playing through the campaign, unlocking way points, grabbing Alters of Lillith, region progressions. You need to advance the regions and get those Shrines in order to get all your points for skills and the paragon boards. The shrines are account wide, so you only have to do them once. Unless you play both HC and SC, then you'll have to complete that all for each version.
I was there with you at the start of the season. Just play the story and enjoy it. Play with different weapons and skills. Once you finish the story, the mechanics and skills should be comfortable for you. If you want to do high-level play, go look up a Maxroll or IcyVeins build for your character and start getting equipment for that.
But to start, just run around and hit things while the game tells you the Tragedy of Lilith.
Yup, this is the traditional hardcore experience. Be glad you haven't died to a lag spike, only to bosses with nasty affixes while not being invulnerable enough.
I was playing my softcore Frozen Orb sorceress in pit >70 a few days ago for the first time. It felt like any time I forgot to switch from one armor to the next armor (cycling frost armor, fire shield and the post-teleport damage reduction shield) while close to mobs I'd get instagibbed. I can't imagine even thinking about hardcore with such a character....
Another vote for "just play" -- you don't need to think about min-maxing while doing the campaign, that's something to think about as you get to maybe level 50. Even at endgame you don't need to slavishly follow the "best builds."
Try stuff, find what you enjoy.
You'll keep getting better gear drops fairly often so don't put any effort into finding the "best" gear, and for your first character I'd say to stay on world tier 1 for the campaign.
Also, don't be afraid to try different character classes, and even in the same character class, there are different ways to play. I used to play as a melee rogue.
You will (eventually) want the following:
1. All the Lilith altars.
2. All Renown maxed
3. All desired Legendary Powers for the build you're pursuing.
As everybody else mentioned, just enjoy your time for now. Focus on the story (skip side quests unless you want to do them - you don't really need them. Later in the main story you get a horse so you can move around faster.) Do make a point of picking up Lilith altars if you're nearby one (there are maps online) but don't go too far out of your way. #2 can be achieved at the same time as #3 - the fastest way to do that is to run each dungeon once, and finish all the Strongholds. (Do the strongholds first)
I'm actually guessing my barb death was due to a lag spike - there was literally NOTHING by me when I died. Didn't even see a ballista shot from one of those skeleton instant death machines...
I do really like all the side quests as they add a ton of background story. I read every line and imagine what the characters are going through. The only issue is you out-leveling your world level, but you can just fight the boss and move to the next world level as needed.
Coming back to the ridiculous Heart of Selig uber....
My bash barb can literally ignore everything in pit level 101 now, on the way to taking down the boss while standing in whatever crap the boss is spewing (and this is with only around 47k health). Talk about getting bad habits.... The survivability from that necklace is literally build changing.
I could probably push 20 pit levels higher, but right now 101 felt like the bosses were starting to take multiple minutes to beat, and my total runs were heading above 5 minutes each, so it's a good place to chain run.
Edit: I had a quick look on the PTR. The copy of our characters took place before the weekend as far as I can tell (missing some of my ubers and latest updates). Bash has indeed been heavily nerfed as expected. There are also 20 odd new aspects, along with those new uniques, so new builds will no doubt spring up fast over the next week of PTR play.
Still, doesn't matter for this season. I hope that a good Druid build (maybe pulverize or something like that) will spring up for me to play in Season 5. Otherwise I'll main another Barbarian - they are always a lot of fun.
My bash barb can literally ignore everything in pit level 101 now, on the way to taking down the boss while standing in whatever crap the boss is spewing (and this is with only around 47k health). Talk about getting bad habits.... The survivability from that necklace is literally build changing.
I could probably push 20 pit levels higher, but right now 101 felt like the bosses were starting to take multiple minutes to beat, and my total runs were heading above 5 minutes each, so it's a good place to chain run.
Edit: I had a quick look on the PTR. The copy of our characters took place before the weekend as far as I can tell (missing some of my ubers and latest updates). Bash has indeed been heavily nerfed as expected. There are also 20 odd new aspects, along with those new uniques, so new builds will no doubt spring up fast over the next week of PTR play.
Still, doesn't matter for this season. I hope that a good Druid build (maybe pulverize or something like that) will spring up for me to play in Season 5. Otherwise I'll main another Barbarian - they are always a lot of fun.
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In "today I learned: Barbarian", I had been picking +thorns for tempering boots since that seemed better than +barrier when I had to pick something, but last night I happened to roll +2 Outburst and finally looked up what it does. Holy crap, at level 100 with high bonus life it gave me another 7,500+ thorns. That "10 thorns per 50 bonus life" really adds up at endgame.
Add me to the "new player" list as well. I picked it up on sale just before Christmas and started a Druid but it just didn't grab me at all, I think it was partially the gameplay and also the very initial part of the story was just a bit too grim for my mood at the time.
I saw the stuff about "Loot Reborn" and figured I'd give it another go, and went back to my traditional starting point in any fantasy game, a Sorceress. Having a LOT more fun now, and I think perhaps my biggest favourite thing over Diablo III is how you can transmog items from almost the very outset, but you're applying it to a SLOT and not an individual item, so I can keep my character looking cool as I pick up new and better stuff! I'm definitely not someone who can be bothered grinding in the endgame, but I'm looking forward to seeing where the story goes and trying out the other classes one I'm done.
I saw the stuff about "Loot Reborn" and figured I'd give it another go, and went back to my traditional starting point in any fantasy game, a Sorceress. Having a LOT more fun now, and I think perhaps my biggest favourite thing over Diablo III is how you can transmog items from almost the very outset, but you're applying it to a SLOT and not an individual item, so I can keep my character looking cool as I pick up new and better stuff! I'm definitely not someone who can be bothered grinding in the endgame, but I'm looking forward to seeing where the story goes and trying out the other classes one I'm done.
Oh yes I saw those already, haha. I could see myself buying some stuff but not until I'm sure I'm going to be playing it longer term. I'm quite enjoying mixing and matching what I've gotten from just salvaging regular gear at the moment.
I've bought some too, as well as the high-end digital expansion. I'm a sucker for Diablo stuff
I surprised myself, because this isn't an MMO with a photo mode or anything like that so I didn't think I'd care about cosmetics.
However D4 is cunning in that the character screen and a bunch of loading screens all show your character zoomed up close in their gear, plus they got a wardrobe operational at launch (unlike the armoury feature which is still in the planning stage). After seeing mediocre skins on your character often enough, you can't help but take a look in the cosmetics shop.... Well at least I couldn't.
And besides, I played D3 on and off from launch until last year. I see each cosmetic skin as something I'll be using for years to come and then the price isn't quite so stupid.
However D4 is cunning in that the character screen and a bunch of loading screens all show your character zoomed up close in their gear, plus they got a wardrobe operational at launch (unlike the armoury feature which is still in the planning stage). After seeing mediocre skins on your character often enough, you can't help but take a look in the cosmetics shop.... Well at least I couldn't.
And besides, I played D3 on and off from launch until last year. I see each cosmetic skin as something I'll be using for years to come and then the price isn't quite so stupid.
Honestly, I liked the basic season gear, this time. I dyed it to match the style I wanted, chose a custom headdress, and I was good to go. I don't know if I'll ever buy cosmetics, but I do enjoy playing with them when one drops. Ghost Horse looks pretty good, for example.
As someone who also just started D4 a few weeks ago, I would recommend Tier 2 if you have any experience with ARPGs. I didn't feel like there was remotely any challenge until I got to about level 50 WT3 where I started aggressively upgrading gear and then again at Tier 4.
I agree with the gentleman Meat. If you're comfortable with the genre, starting at Tier 2 isn't a bad idea.
I put this season down when my Necro got the grindy point. I was considering starting an alt, but I think I'll wait for season 5 since FFXIV is going to devour my life again. Does anyone know how helltides are being handled on the PTR? The increased frequency was a big sell to me in season 4 since there was always multiple ways I could just go murder things when I logged on.
I put this season down when my Necro got the grindy point. I was considering starting an alt, but I think I'll wait for season 5 since FFXIV is going to devour my life again. Does anyone know how helltides are being handled on the PTR? The increased frequency was a big sell to me in season 4 since there was always multiple ways I could just go murder things when I logged on.
They mentioned that they wanted each Helltide zone to give 10 whisper points and take roughly 15 minutes to complete those points. Versus 50 minute helltides with 4 (or sometimes 6) whisper points on offer in Season 4, but I'm not sure if they are making Helltides shorter as well - it didn't mention that in the summary.
Regarding World Tier 1 or 2 for levelling: I think Season 4's power boost (with legendary aspects becoming collected and permanently available, plus easy and cheap to apply to any new piece of gear) meant that WT2 is plenty easy enough for levelling a new character. However if you are doing the story rather than Adventure Mode and jumping straight into helltides you might struggle a little.
P.S. I got the Treasure Beast horse saddle cosmetic off the world boss last week. It actually works well on the ghost horse or the Season 4 glowy white horse. Unfortunately it doesn't look as good on Brimstone (the horse with fiery hooves which drops from Tormented bosses). I find myself using the free Brimstone horse the most, despite owning a bunch of premium season pass horses.
Regarding World Tier 1 or 2 for levelling: I think Season 4's power boost (with legendary aspects becoming collected and permanently available, plus easy and cheap to apply to any new piece of gear) meant that WT2 is plenty easy enough for levelling a new character. However if you are doing the story rather than Adventure Mode and jumping straight into helltides you might struggle a little.
P.S. I got the Treasure Beast horse saddle cosmetic off the world boss last week. It actually works well on the ghost horse or the Season 4 glowy white horse. Unfortunately it doesn't look as good on Brimstone (the horse with fiery hooves which drops from Tormented bosses). I find myself using the free Brimstone horse the most, despite owning a bunch of premium season pass horses.
Well I'm slowly reaching the limit of what a non-bleed based bash build can reach in the pit (I'm around 130 at the moment). Maybe with some lucky master working and a good pit composition I can get to 140. Otherwise I'll probably have to switch to flay or a bleed based bash build instead.
Found this in a NMD this morning...
Debating if I should sell or use. diablo.trade has something similar for 600m, but I don't know that I need THAT much money for the rest of the season (I just want to hit 100 on this barb, who is at 77), and that is a REALLY nice pair of boots.
Debating if I should sell or use. diablo.trade has something similar for 600m, but I don't know that I need THAT much money for the rest of the season (I just want to hit 100 on this barb, who is at 77), and that is a REALLY nice pair of boots.
Well I got a sign I should make a flay barb.
I already bound it to my account so I can't trade it, but I probably could have gotten at least 4 billion gold for it.
I already bound it to my account so I can't trade it, but I probably could have gotten at least 4 billion gold for it.