"Official" Watch thread

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jaberg

jaberg

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  • #4,241
    I did an in-store try-on of the Ultra 2 a couple of months back. I was allowed a test fit with the adapted Leatherman Tread that serves as band for my current S3. I was concerned that the additional size would make the band too loose — but not so much as to allow removing another link. In practice the Watch was slightly looser on my wrist, but not problematically so. The Watch itself felt (and looked) fine on my wrist. Not the bulkiest I’ve ever worn, and comfortably in the range for EDC. It should fit under any shirt cuffs that accomodate a mechanical watch. The weight was unnoticeable surrounded by the stainless steel Tread.

    Someday.
     
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    wco81

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  • #4,242
    What are the main pulls of the Ultra.

    I know about the battery life but I have no problems with putting my Watch on the charger at the end of the night. My Series 6 never gets to 20% or less.

    I don't have any interest in sleep tracking.

    So bigger display but I'm never going to read anything in detail, will always have my phone handy.

    I don't swim. I suppose if I went to a hot tub, it might be nice to have better water protection but the hot chlorinated water is probably not a good idea.
     
    cateye

    cateye

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  • #4,243
    I think you've pretty much identified what people like about it. But, it's up to you whether those things matter or not. Speaking to what attracts me to the Ultra over my Series 6 (which is otherwise performant and I'm perfectly happy with in most metrics):
    • Bigger screen. My older eyes often have a hard time reading some of the text on complications, etc. The whole point of the Watch for me is to avoid going to my phone to answer/triage information/communication. The phone is a distraction and there are times I want to leave it in my pocket. So the more I can accomplish on the Watch comfortably, the more useful a tool it is. The S7 (and later) have larger screens, but not enough compared to my S6.
    • Longer battery life. On an average day this isn't a problem with my S6 as I end up with around 20-30% left. However, I love to go hiking, snowshoeing, etc. I was out in the mountains for a full day last week and tracked about 3 hours of snowshoeing (with frequent workout pauses, etc.). By the time I got back to my car I was under 10% and it was barely 3pm. That's not enough battery headroom for me.
    That's honestly it. I'm active and outdoorsy, but I don't scuba dive or swim, so I won't take advantage of those features. I've managed to own a Series 3 and a Series 6 (both the lower-end aluminum/ion-x varieties) without ever shattering the crystals or scratching the cases beyond very minor scuffs, etc. so the durability of the chonky titanium is nice, but mostly a "gravy" feature.

    If Apple made a regular watch with a beefier battery and, say, a 47 or 48mm case and proportionally larger screen, I probably wouldn’t be considering the Ultra.
     
    jaberg

    jaberg

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  • #4,244
    I do dive, but no longer regularly. Still, a Watch rated for the life aquatic is a boon to me. Plus, the other outdoorsy features. My own experience with the Ion Glass isn’t as positive as that of Cateye so I’d be in the market for another stainless or titanium model with the sapphire crystal anyhow. The Ultra premium borders on the no brainer for me.
     
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    analogika

    analogika

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  • #4,248
    I usually gig out of town on weekends, and I use the watch for sleep tracking, so I’d LOVE for the Watch to last at least 36 hours, better yet, 48 or sixty hours for double-gig weekends.

    Charging in the morning during breakfast is usually possible, but not always, and often inconvenient.

    The bigger Series 6 I wear is already almost too large, so an Ultra is out of the question.
     
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    gregatron5

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  • #4,251
    analogika said:
    I usually gig out of town on weekends, and I use the watch for sleep tracking, so I’d LOVE for the Watch to last at least 36 hours, better yet, 48 or sixty hours for double-gig weekends.

    Charging in the morning during breakfast is usually possible, but not always, and often inconvenient.

    The bigger Series 6 I wear is already almost too large, so an Ultra is out of the question.
    Click to expand...
    In situations like this I've found it handy to charge from an iPad or even a car's USB port. Dedicating time near a wall outlet can be difficult, but charing in a bag from the iPad has really helped out more than a few times.
     
    analogika

    analogika

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  • #4,252
    gregatron5 said:
    In situations like this I've found it handy to charge from an iPad or even a car's USB port. Dedicating time near a wall outlet can be difficult, but charing in a bag from the iPad has really helped out more than a few times.
    Click to expand...
    Sure. I do that all the time between MacBook/iPhone/iPad, curiously — the USB-C ports make this super feasible.

    But that doesn't work with the Watch, for me: it's wearable, so it feels weird when I'm not wearing it, and the magnetic port means it will often disconnect and just not charge if it isn't actually just laying on a steady surface.

    I wonder if the barrier were lower if I bought a USB-C charging cable…
     
    analogika

    analogika

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  • #4,254
    gregatron5 said:
    Ah. I have a USB-C charger for my watch, so it will charge from just about anything except my phone (until I upgrade that). I’ve definitely sat down to breakfast and run a cord from my iPad out of my bag onto the bag (so I can see it and make sure it’s connected) to charge my watch.
    Click to expand...

    I've taken the moment to add a 2 cm USB-C —> USB-A adapter to the cable. I'll throw it in the same pocket with the USB-C and USB-C —> Lightning cables and see if it makes a difference to my usage/perception.

    Thanks for the nudge!
     
    cateye

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  • #4,255
    Despite all my AW Ultra curiosity, I couldn't get over the hump of the size, or the design or... something. I do like it, a lot, but there was something about spending $700-odd whatever on it that I couldn't pull the trigger. It didn't gel with me on some level. Must've tried it on like a half dozen times at my two closest AppleStores (and how great it is that they happily let me wander around the store with it on so I could really get a feel for it?)

    Anywho, was content to just not worry about upgrading, and then... had a unique situation fall into my lap to get a Series 9 for basically free once all was said and done, so... why not.

    The differences are definitely subtle, coming from my Series 6. The overall speed-up feels a bit like getting a new iPhone these days: Doesn't bowl you over, but there's a quality of life improvement that's welcome. Having the weather complication pop right open to showing me data instead of watching the "please wait" spinner for three or four seconds is great.

    Ultimately, I think what I didn't realize until now is I'm a fan of the subtlety of the "regular" Apple Watch, in every sense. I appreciate what it does for me in the background, and am not really looking to trade away its compactness and simplicity to gain anything else. Not yet, anyway—there may still be an Ultra for me in the future, once it slims down and loses some of its "LOOK AT ME" qualities (not at all a criticism, I'm not equating the Ultra to some button-festooned Mega Uber-Athlete Wötch or something, but... it's just not for me).

    On another note: How janky has the Watch transfer process become? It took me four tries with a myriad of errors before it finally completed, mostly related to the fact that the 9 showed up with an older version of WatchOS than the backup of my 6 had. I knew I could just set up the 9 as new, update it, then worry about transfering over my 6's data, but I kept thinking "surely this will work..." And then, I got all these notifications (as expected) on my other Apple devices that a new device had been added to my account that had access to iMessage, etc. except it said that device was an iPad. 😐 Come on, Apple.
     
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    Semi On

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  • #4,256
    cateye said:
    Despite all my AW Ultra curiosity, I couldn't get over the hump of the size, or the design or... something. I do like it, a lot, but there was something about spending $700-odd whatever on it that I couldn't pull the trigger. It didn't gel with me on some level. Must've tried it on like a half dozen times at my two closest AppleStores (and how great it is that they happily let me wander around the store with it on so I could really get a feel for it?)
    Click to expand...

    The big bump around the button on the side is a real problem for me, aesthetically, and probably why I haven't pulled the trigger yet.
     
    cateye

    cateye

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  • #4,260
    MacRumors has coverage as well. It sounds like the functionality is being disabled in new Series 9 and Ultra 2 watches only, and that modified watches are already on their way to retailers. It is not being disabled in watches people already own (a la Force Touch).

    Rhetorical, of course, but: Have we not reached the point where hammering out some kind of deal with Masimo might make more sense?
     
    Jonathon

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  • #4,261
    belazeebub said:
    Hmm, CNN is claiming that Apple is removing the pulse oximetry functionality from watchOS to work around the Masimo lawsuit. Cue the class-action lawsuit(s).

    https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/15/tech/apple-watch-ban-fix/index.html
    Click to expand...
    That's referencing this filing, which indicates that Apple intends to sell "redesigned Watch products" that do not include pulse oximetry functionality. Which would imply that they're intending to ship new watches without pulse oximetry to get around the import ban, but doesn't necessarily mean they're removing it from existing watches (which is what would potentially trigger a class-action suit by customers).
     
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    wco81

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  • #4,262
    cateye said:
    MacRumors has coverage as well. It sounds like the functionality is being disabled in new Series 9 and Ultra 2 watches only, and that modified watches are already on their way to retailers. It is not being disabled in watches people already own (a la Force Touch).

    Rhetorical, of course, but: Have we not reached the point where hammering out some kind of deal with Masimo might make more sense?
    Click to expand...
    If they cut a deal with Massimo, they've be opening themselves up to far more litigation and extortion attempts.

    As I heard it, the merits of the case aren't that strong for Massimo.
     
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    Chris FOM

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  • #4,263
    cateye said:
    MacRumors has coverage as well. It sounds like the functionality is being disabled in new Series 9 and Ultra 2 watches only, and that modified watches are already on their way to retailers. It is not being disabled in watches people already own (a la Force Touch).

    Rhetorical, of course, but: Have we not reached the point where hammering out some kind of deal with Masimo might make more sense?
    Click to expand...
    I’ve wondered the same thing. Cook plays very aggressive hardball, but when he’s got a losing hand he’s typically pragmatic enough to know when to fold (unlike Jobs who would happily curt off his nose to spite his face on principle). I can only imagine that the reason Apple hasn’t cut a deal at this point is either a, Masimo is angry enough they’re not willing to take the money or b, Masimo’s offered deal for licensing was a number Apple simply wouldn’t/couldn’t accept (not impossible if they were looking for medical licensing rates, those margins make Apple look positively generous).
     
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    wrylachlan

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  • #4,264
    cateye said:
    Rhetorical, of course, but: Have we not reached the point where hammering out some kind of deal with Masimo might make more sense?
    Click to expand...
    If Masimo wins then they essentially will entirely own personal SO2 as the patent is so broad it’s hard to imagine any implementation of wrist-based O2 that doesn’t fall foul of their patents. So this is a pretty big threat to Apple’s Apple Watch ambitions long term.

    And bigger picture, health tech is rife with over-broad patents that are making companies bank as they charge hospitals big bucks. Pretty much any tech they add to Apple Watch there’s probably someone out there with a dodgy patent currently milking the health system.

    If they hold their ground, take it to court and overturn the patents, not only will they get SO2 back for free, but every other health tech will look at their fragile patent portfolio and think “I’m happy just continuing to milk the hospitals - no need to poke the bear.”
     
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    Scud

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  • #4,265
    wrylachlan said:
    If Masimo wins then they essentially will entirely own personal SO2 as the patent is so broad it’s hard to imagine any implementation of wrist-based O2 that doesn’t fall foul of their patents. So this is a pretty big threat to Apple’s Apple Watch ambitions long term.
    Click to expand...
    Apple could easily do R&D to develop their own tech as other US companies did. Patent theft is apparently the easier and cheaper route.
     
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    wrylachlan

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  • #4,266
    Scud said:
    Apple could easily do R&D to develop their own tech as other US companies did. Patent theft is apparently the easier and cheaper route.
    Click to expand...
    Is your assumption that other O2 sensors on other wearables are non-infringing because Masimo hasn’t sued them yet? Because everything I’ve read says there’s no meaningful way to do wearable O2 that doesn’t infringe.
     
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    Scud

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  • #4,267
    That is correct. Google and Garmin and at least over a dozen other companies have numerous patents on O2 sensors. It’s like saying there is only one way to record a heart rate. That’s just bonkers and is not how health tech generally works

    The ITC said only 5 claims of two patents were violated. The specificity of the tech is outlined here; https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/abstract/document/1404497

    What exactly do you think Massimo has that every single O2 sensor violates?
     
    cateye

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  • #4,268
    Apple lost its appeal and the sales ban on Watches that contain the pulse ox feature is back on as of tomorrow. But, the reporting is a little confusing—does this account for Apple's software "fix" to disable pulse ox features in newly sold watches? I don't think so, but maybe someone else has seen better reporting somewhere that explains this.
     
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    OAW

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  • #4,269
    cateye said:
    Apple lost its appeal and the sales ban on Watches that contain the pulse ox feature is back on as of tomorrow. But, the reporting is a little confusing—does this account for Apple's software "fix" to disable pulse ox features in newly sold watches? I don't think so, but maybe someone else has seen better reporting somewhere that explains this.
    Click to expand...
    Given the reporting I've seen a firmware update will go out that disables the pulse ox feature for newly sold Apple Watches. Which will allow them to keep the devices on the market because if they don't have that feature then they don't fall within the scope of the ban. If they remove all mention of it in their official marketing materials prior to deploying the firmware update then that should mitigate the risk of a class action lawsuit by existing customers who purchased it with the feature enabled. Personally, I couldn't care less as I've owned an AW9 for about six months now and have never once used the pulse ox feature.
     
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    wco81

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  • #4,270
    OAW said:
    Given the reporting I've seen a firmware update will go out that disables the pulse ox feature for newly sold Apple Watches. Which will allow them to keep the devices on the market because if they don't have that feature then they don't fall within the scope of the ban. If they remove all mention of it in their official marketing materials prior to deploying the firmware update then that should mitigate the risk of a class action lawsuit by existing customers who purchased it with the feature enabled. Personally, I couldn't care less as I've owned an AW9 for about six months now and have never once used the pulse ox feature.
    Click to expand...
    Even if you don't use it, you can check the Health app and I believe it charts it.

    It's not as needed as much any more because current covid strains aren't attacking deep into the lungs, leading to lower blood O2 percentage.
     
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    Chris FOM

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  • #4,274
    grahamb said:
    It's also useful in conjunction with the sleep tracking as it can be an indicator of sleep apnea.
    Click to expand...
    Sort of. Most people with sleep apnea aren’t persistently hypoxic but only during actual apnea. Since the watch only spot checks oxygen sats it can easily miss the hypoxic events. That’s why a formal sleep study monitors pulse oximetry continuously instead of intermittently. If the watch did spot a low I’d take it seriously and do some investigating but normal levels could easily give a false sense that nothing is wrong.
     
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    Entegy

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  • #4,275
    So for the last 36 hours my Watch SE had massive battery drain. I was at 3% at 15 hours of wearing it. I finally realize today it was because it was downloading and preparing the new 10.5 update. But there was no indication what was happening! I also thought iOS on the iPhone needed to be updated before watchOS.

    Very frustrating to watch the power drop super quickly and never found out why. I'm sure I didn't help the process when I restarted the watch in an attempt to stop it.

    Is this normal? I actually usually update my stuff within an hour of release since I am on top of the news, but yesterday I was busy and not paying attention to tech news. It just seems so weird Apple would let the watch cut its battery life in half with no indication why.
     
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    Honeybog

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  • #4,277
    I would suggest getting it on a familiar WiFi network and seeing if it syncs to iCloud.

    I know that Apple Watch information is somehow tied to Apple IDs. When I logged my wife into my phone to try and sort a Home App issue, all of her workout data got merged into the Health app and stayed even after I logged her out. I had to delete her watch as a source in order to clear all of the incorrect records.
     
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    Honeybog

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  • #4,280
    Watch Ultra owners: What, if any, benefits are there over the regular Watch if you don’t dive/climb/etc?

    I’m probably updating from my S5 this year, just so I can use the upcoming workout rest days feature (sigh). I’m marginally interested in an Ultra, just to get slightly longer update support (I wouldn’t otherwise replace my S5 unless the releases this year do something really special), but since I’m not a diver or similarly involved sport person, it’s not clear what other benefit there would be besides longer battery life (which isn’t an issue on my S5 with 82% battery health, anyway).
     
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