Stellaris 3.12 Andromeda

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Thorvard

Thorvard

Ars Legatus Legionis
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  • #1
    Didn't see another thread and I know we have some Paradox/grand strategy fans here.

    Most codes have gone out and the game seems to have officially released(Got my GMG code just now).

    Early reviews seem very promising, IGN And PC Gamer both gave it lower scores. From PC Gamer:

    I'm disappointed, because Stellaris's first few hours hinted at a smart, scintillating reinvention of the 4X. The early game is packed full of personality, but it's squandered as the hours roll on. Maybe I had a particularly bad late game experience—the random nature of each campaign suggests many potential outcomes. But the glacial pace feels intentional, and the long periods of inaction bring other limitations to the fore. How most research is purely a stat boost, with only a scant few technologies progressing the story in fun, inventive ways. How presidential candidates have so few mandates, often cycling between just two basic objectives. How espionage is an obvious omission, especially when effective combat is so dependant on information
    Click to expand...

    From Destructoid:

    On top of all this, random events will take place to help spice things up. Players will come across artifacts on ancient planets or even budding civilizations. There's so much to discover in Stellaris and no two games are remotely alike, and you can bet that players out there will be spending thousands of hours roaming various galaxies. In this case, it will certainly be time well spent. I can't even begin to imagine the intricate multiplayer conflicts that will go down when dozens of players get together to compete in space.
    Click to expand...
     
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    Viridis

    Ars Praefectus
    3,451
  • #2
    The IGN review had two interesting points about war & sectors

    Essentially, the issue is that the goals you set before a war are too big: things like capturing or freeing an enemy colony or vassalizing an enemy empire. There are no options for something smaller-scale, like shifting a border star system into your sphere of influence in order to get that tundra planet for colonization. It all feels all-or-nothing.

    ...

    Putting planets in sectors hides them in the menus that show lists of planets, so there’s no way to quickly access them. And planets in sectors don’t build ships or improve their space stations on their own,
    Click to expand...

    Everyone seems to agree that the initial expansion phase is great, but the mid-game appears so different from usual 4X games that you still do need to go in with a Grand Strategy mindset, I guess.
     
    H

    HappyBunny

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  • #4
    Having watched some streams and heard Austin Walker from Giant Bomb talking about this, I'm pretty excited. There's a core of 4x familiarity there but it seems like it does enough differently to be interesting. I've never been able to get into Paradox games but this seems like it eases you in more smoothly.

    To me, most recent space 4x games have just been dull rehashes of old tropes which lost my interest quickly, so I'm stoked to see a different take on things.
     
    Rubel

    Rubel

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  • #5
    I'm excited about this game! I am a bit of a Paradox fanboy, and I love 4X games as much as anybody. Not enough to call in sick to work today, but enough to *gurk* preorder.

    Let me know what you folks think so I have something to fuel my dreams before I get home.

    I enjoyed Rock Paper Paper Shotgun's take on it. https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2016/0 ... review-pc/
     
    W

    woozie

    Ars Praetorian
    539
  • #7
    6 hours in and on my 2nd campaign, I managed to piss off my neighbours in the first one and they just waltzed over me... this one is going a little better though.

    9 hours in and I have 2 Vassals, one from Uplifting and one from a good old fashioned interstellar war, had I pressed my luck I could have had a 3rd.

    After a few years of Aggressive research on Sol III
    gfA6UE9.jpg


    Success, I have uplifted the Human race and made them my bitch, and just in time for them to help pacify some bird people and pop their interstellar war cherry.
    WVstMPH.jpg
     
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    Robotank

    Ars Tribunus Militum
    2,476
  • #9
    I picked this up with the idea that I'd play an hour and get a taste for the game last night. 4 hours later I realized I had just made a dangerous life choice...
    The early game is very strong here. It's a wonderful blend of familiar 4x expansion with new systems and choices and RNG events. I feel like my meaningful progression is coming along slowly, but the RNG discoveries and events are giving me a pretty regular injection of interesting.

    I'm playing as the pacifist fanatic collectivist fungal mass "The Overgrowth". We grow and expand at all costs and all others shall make way for us. Unfortunately, the pacifist nature is getting in the way of my demand for growth and I'm having a very difficult time working with my neighbors in any non-aggressive way.

    I also have two quest chains that require me to scan specific planets, but unfortunately both fall within the borders of empires that I don't have open borders with. They aren't much in the mood to share borders with me or grant me temporary access, and going to war would be quite a mistake for me right now... I guess those quests are stuck for now (and maybe a few centuries).
     
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    gothmog1114

    Ars Praetorian
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  • #10
    I started last night in a sparsely populated galaxy to learn the ropes. There was no way I couldn't play as a worm like race on a desert planet with the potential to eventually have a God-Emperor. Plus, it's a Paradox strategy game, so I need some Deus Vult action. Even with a smaller population, space feels pretty full. I found a few other empires setting up a border on me right off the bat.

    Also, I have pirates everywhere. I had to spend a ton of minerals building up an early fleet to clear some systems close by to get more resources.

    I'm enjoying it so far, but I think the mods are going to put it over the top. Just looking at what people were able to do with CK2 with things like the GoT conversion has me salivating at the chance to have recreations of Dune or Star Wars.
     
    Thorvard

    Thorvard

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  • #11
    I jumped straight into a large map with a ton of AI. Because I was militaristic all of my neighbors were not thrilled with me, and it took a while to get a alliance.

    I am looking forward to the mods, Star Wars and Mass Effect are 2 that I think will be great with this. Plus knowing Paradox we'll be getting expansion packs for the next 5+ years.
     
    I

    isaacwith2as

    Wise, Aged Ars Veteran
    189
  • #12
    Oranging this for the glory of the Gorf Space Commonwealth of fungal greatness!

    So far I've managed to conquer one species of avians by surgically altering my fungus people to replace key leaders, and then uplifting another set of avians into shock troops. My only complaint right now is I have a 4 to 5 year election cycle, and everyone's mandate is to build more stations, even though every mining/research spot has been filled for a while. So all leaders get one term before being turfed for missing their mandate.

    Despite not having turns, their is the "one more turn" feel of just wanting to get that next tech, or finish some project etc. Loving this so far.
     
    V

    Viridis

    Ars Praefectus
    3,451
  • #14
    Something which just occurred to me. Yes, you can switch out scientists between controlling research and leading science ships. So when both of your scientist ship leaders die within a year, I can replace with experienced leaders.

    I'm doing a (relatively boring) collectivist/pacifist/xenophile foxes run. Exploring the world and empire building is fun, but we'll see how the mid-game goes.

    Now I'm just busy freaking out because I did an anomaly event that ended up with a single planet having 9 engineering research. :)
     
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    frozentech

    Ars Praefectus
    3,038
  • #18
    So, me and some buddies sat down to this without really bothering with the tutorial and rolled up a rather big game. We spent about 3 hours on an 800 star game with about oh, 15 total AI and the 5 of us.

    Needless to say... there was a lot of exploring going on... and not a lot else. I expect the early game will go on for at least anther 4-6 hours. Then we'll get into the experimental midgame where we actually start trying to compete with alien AI empires. And possibly ourselves, but we're spread all over the place so we're not exactly close.

    Part of that is we were playing on slow for the first hour or so as we got our feet wet. As a Paradox Fanboi this is one of the best interfaces they've done and it was very easy to find everything.

    Non-Paradox players may not say the same thing.

    Multiplayer was very smooth, though we had one guy who couldn't find the game in the server browser and apparently hotjoining a game currently glitches if you have a password set up, though once you're in, you can hot join without issue. But the game needs to be created with your race - hot joining a game that is in progress you've never been part of you will only have the hosts races to work with.

    I'll let you all know what we thing in a few months when we actually *finish* a game. But we're all enjoying it quite a bit so far.
     
    A

    andrewd18

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  • #19
    Whoever designed the new tutorial system and situation report needs a raise. This is hands down the easiest Paradox game I've learned to play. I'm sure part of it is from being a long time 4X player, but I actually feel like I know what I'm doing.

    I'm sure some space fungi will be along shortly to dissuade me of that notion and my solar systems.
     
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    Robotank

    Ars Tribunus Militum
    2,476
  • #20
    [url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=31159015#p31159015:2s7ue4ki said:
    andrewd18[/url]":2s7ue4ki]Whoever designed the new tutorial system and situation report needs a raise. This is hands down the easiest Paradox game I've learned to play. I'm sure part of it is from being a long time 4X player, but I actually feel like I know what I'm doing.

    I'm sure some space fungi will be along shortly to dissuade me of that notion and my solar systems.
    Click to expand...
    ++ to the tutorial experience. I haven't played any Paradox grand strategy titles (although I've seen quite a bit of them) and I really don't play a lot of 4X games, but this system was easy to get started with. The situation report gives me a very clear list of what "interesting things" I can work towards next and the tutorial tasks fit into that experience near seamlessly.

    The UI has some confusing moments, especially when several fleets are in close proximity. My home system is usually a crapshoot if I want to find or select something specific. I'm getting used to using the menus, though, and this level of deep micro won't survive into mid/late game anyway.
     
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    Alexander

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  • #23
    The interface seems poorly planned. It's pretty frustrating to right-click on a ship to zoom the camera in on it, but when you try to give it commands you still have another ship halfway across the map selected. I also though the transition between galaxy and system maps was awkward and felt arbitrary; why not just let you scroll-zoom all the way in on a system and back out to the galaxy map? That transition is another place where you end up being pulled back and forth across the map.

    I did really like the initial exploring and first colonization phase, and the focus on science. They got that part mostly right, it's much more engaging than say MOO2 or Endless Space. Like some of the posters upthread, I got my ass handed to me as soon as my neighbors got annoyed with my shenanigans, so I can't speak to anything but the beginning. So that's my review: exploration is fun and well done, the controls are annoying and poorly thought out.
     
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    Arbelac

    Ars Tribunus Angusticlavius
    7,449
  • #24
    So, I've put in about 7 hours today, and it's just freaking great. The tutorial and UI guys need a fucking raise, it's extremely well done.

    I started an Ironman game so no cheating :D , and so far so good. I like the slow ramp, and the little touches/callouts to stuff like Star Trek:

    Space Amoebas (TOS - The Immunity Syndrome)
    Crystalline Entity (TNG - Datalore, Silicon Avatar )
    Placid Leviathans (TNG - Tin Man)

    The Steam achievements have some culture references as well, PDK/Blade Runner, Starcraft, Jurassic Park...

    I'm sure there's more... and some of the anomalies have been interesting as well.
     
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    frozentech

    Ars Praefectus
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  • #25
    he interface seems poorly planned. It's pretty frustrating to right-click on a ship to zoom the camera in on it, but when you try to give it commands you still have another ship halfway across the map selected. I also though the transition between galaxy and system maps was awkward and felt arbitrary; why not just let you scroll-zoom all the way in on a system and back out to the galaxy map? That transition is another place where you end up being pulled back and forth across the map.
    Click to expand...

    This... is exactly what I was talking about when I said that as a Paradox veteran my tolerance for wonky UI is *way* higher then some people. :D
     
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    Robotank

    Ars Tribunus Militum
    2,476
  • #26
    [url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=31162591#p31162591:2dftqhd4 said:
    Alexander[/url]":2dftqhd4]Like some of the posters upthread, I got my ass handed to me as soon as my neighbors got annoyed with my shenanigans, so I can't speak to anything but the beginning.
    Click to expand...
    I think this is part of the adjustment from the typical 4X symmetric start to the Crusader King's approach of having very unbalanced starts between rulers. Stellaris isn't quite that skewed (at least not my game), but then there are the Fallen Empires that could easily squash you if you came anywhere near their Holy Planet / Dyson Ring / Sentient AI.

    I think I'm officially in mid-game now. I've revealed most of the map and found all 17 other governments. My 6 colonies are split up into sectors so I only manually control the homeworld (and I think I do a shitty job of it, but oh well). I don't have very many easily accessible planets to colonize, so I either need to take over a population with different habitation requirements, or I need to start absorbing my neighbors. My nearest neighbor is politically aligned with me, but isn't growing very well. I think I'm going to stack my Fleets on his border and see what happens if I demand he become my vassal...
     
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    tinyMan

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  • #28
    I've played a few opening rounds just to get a flavor of the game and I am really happy about it. My wife may not be though. I can see this game sucking up a lot of hours. I've lost man-weeks of time to Europa Universalis IV, so I'm adapted to Paradox style games.

    I haven't even gotten out of the early-game phase yet, but I've had a number of Moments of Joy from the surprise events and the great flavor text. Some reviews on the internet seem to indicate that the late game phase of Stellaris is a bit lacking, but I really trust Paradox to:

    1) Fix any balance issues and tweak gameplay to keep the challenge going
    2) Ship a monster pile of DLC to keep adding new content

    Also, the modding community is going to have a field day (hopefully).

    Looking forward to losing many, many hours.
     
    C

    Crolis

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  • #30
    I think this is part of the adjustment from the typical 4X symmetric start to the Crusader King's approach of having very unbalanced starts between rulers.
    Click to expand...

    Yep, this is what seems to me coming from some of the negative comments I've seen. Yes, it feels like a 4X game at the start through mid game but once the star nations are established it is more like EU4 where it isn't "fair and equal" and some nations (France) are big and badass and not to be trifled with. This if anything is a positive progression of the semi-genre where in most 4X games there is more of a focus on expansion and once you do that you pick off people one by one gaining steam. In this you have to actually do diplomacy and shit and like EU4, you can find your self fucked if the wrong nation takes an interest in you.

    I think the mods are going to be awesome after seeing what paradox themselves put in. Just having a mod that adds a ton of NPC "monster" races would be great.
     
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    atreusmonk

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  • #31
    I think that's also why they have the "Advanced AI" slider. You can play it with a start entirely like Civ - everyone on "equal" footing - or you can play with lots of more advanced races that start out with multiple systems under their control.

    It would be interesting to me for them to add something where you could pregenerate a map filled to the brim with races and just select one to start as. The whole thing could be random or you could preselect things, but that might help bridge the gap with players of Paradox's other games.
     
    C

    Crolis

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  • #34
    [url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=31166109#p31166109:ykz27suh said:
    Mortus[/url]":ykz27suh]Is the barrier to entry on this one as high as it is in say CK2? I tried to figure that one out and the tutorial kicked my ass. :p
    Click to expand...

    If you approach it as a 4x game you will instantly feel at home I think, just know it has a different feel in the mid/late game than most 4x games.
     
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    Robotank

    Ars Tribunus Militum
    2,476
  • #35
    [url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=31166109#p31166109:2z8oeqcj said:
    Mortus[/url]":2z8oeqcj]Is the barrier to entry on this one as high as it is in say CK2? I tried to figure that one out and the tutorial kicked my ass. :p
    Click to expand...
    I haven't put any time into CK2, but barrier here is about as low as I've seen for a 4X game. On-par with Civ, easier than Endless Space? The sticking points I've run into are well past where the addiction hooks grab you.
     
    Thorvard

    Thorvard

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  • #36
    [url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=31166337#p31166337:mwwwqhl5 said:
    Robotank[/url]":mwwwqhl5]
    [url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=31166109#p31166109:mwwwqhl5 said:
    Mortus[/url]":mwwwqhl5]Is the barrier to entry on this one as high as it is in say CK2? I tried to figure that one out and the tutorial kicked my ass. :p
    Click to expand...
    I haven't put any time into CK2, but barrier here is about as low as I've seen for a 4X game. On-par with Civ, easier than Endless Space? The sticking points I've run into are well past where the addiction hooks grab you.
    Click to expand...

    Yeah, I've told a few people, if you can play Civ, you can play this. It is a bit more difficult than Civ, but not terribly so. The tutorial is great to get you started as well.
     
    A

    Abulia

    Ars Tribunus Angusticlavius
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  • #39
    Already spent quite a few hours. My "quick" throwaway tutorial game became much longer as I got invested. Really like it, but the UI can be a bit frustrating. It's not much, but here's some things I've learned the hard way...

    Influence is quite hard to gain and a lot of important items use it, in particular, recruiting leaders. Outposts reduce your influence gain so expand by colonies and use outposts sparingly.

    Leaders die (duh!) so have backups ready or influence to recruit replacements. I had no influence and lost several key leaders. Research without a leader takes a 25% penalty and science vessels are useless (can't to anything). So keep a 50 point buffer at all times and have some positive gain.

    Careful mouse placement on the surface of a world will breakdown happiness levels. Keeping happiness up surpesses faction gain, which is brutal. Good leader placement and/or buildings can help with happiness, which also changes as negative effects roll off.

    Capturing a planet and/or enslaving (and then freeing) does give a big happiness hit. However, if you can stick it out, those penalties will go away (they don't degrade, just disappear).

    Factions are tough to combat and their influence cost is prohibitive, so be prepared to tough it out.

    Granting sovereignty to a planet does exactly what you'd think: it turns them into their own space power that you have to negotiate with. Even if they're a vassal they can eventually leave you (or declare war, etc).

    Ship tech is obviously useful but space combat favors numbers over quality, all things being equal. Two roughly equally-sized forces that are split between few good ships and lots of lesser ships seem to favor "the swarm." So build often and mind your naval limit.

    You can retrofit/upgrade your fleets however don't chase it. Going from one beam weapon to the next one is a minimal per-ship increase. However, adding new tech (like deflectors) to a old fleet is mandatory. Select your fleet and there are two buttons you might miss: repair (heal) and upgrade. Both require a spaceport.

    You can fuss with building your own ships or there is an auto-best option that will update each ship type (corvette, destroyer, etc) with the best available tech you've researched.

    After you create a colony you can upgrade the old colony ship to turn it into a planetary administration base. Many of the next tier upgrades require this base and it isn't readily obvious how you get it. Placement of that original colony ship also determines the four adjacency bonuses, so try to land your initial colony ship in the middle on the planet grid. Some surface grids require special tech to clean out their boxes so look a planet over closely before deciding to colonize; if you can't clear those squares it could be a waste.

    Space credits are mostly used to pay maintenance but don't appear to have any secondary effect, like speeding up research. It's easy to have several thousand in excess with nothing to spend them on. Conversely, minerals are used by nearly everything. When given an option, favor minerals over space credits.

    That's all I can think of offhand. The tutorial is great but the game has a LOT of trial and error.
     
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    neuromaster

    Ars Tribunus Militum
    2,022
  • #40
    After a few false starts, I've finally gotten 3-4hrs into a campaign I'm tentatively happy with. Some learning experiences, spoilered for the hyper-sensitive:
    • Completing your first colony triggers pirates. The first time I played I didn't know they were coming or how strong they would be, so they roamed around killing my stuff. The second time I was ready.
    • If you use Technological Enlightenment to turn a pre-FTL race into a vassal empire, they can get a different FTL tech than you. If you integrate them, you can get their ships that use that FTL tech. But you can't design ships with their tech, and if you upgrade they'll switch to your FTL method.
    • You can right-click on a system to have a construction ship build all the possible mining/research platforms in the system.
    • If you neglect your fleet to rush colony ships, your neighbors can and will take advantage of your weakness to declare war.

    I'm at a point now where I'm one planet over my core system cap and need to start thinking about making a sector. Anyone have experience/tips with that? What's the benefit (if any) of giving a sector systems without colonized worlds? How difficult/costly is it to adjust that sort of thing after initially establishing them?
     
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