Satisfactory: A Factorio/Subnautica Hybrid about to be in Early Access

Tegid

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I got to play a little Satisfactory this weekend. It's from the studio that made Sanctum and Goat Simulator and I think this was their last "Alpha Test Weekend". Primarily a single player game, it does support some multiplayer though from the sounds of it, it might be a bit janky. That being said, I kind of think this game would play best as a MP game. It's a factory building game with multi-biome exploration and it appears, some kind of actual End Game.

Given this is an Alpha and the 19th is their initial "Early Access" release on the Epic Games store (for $29.95 which seems a LITTLE steep for EA) I thought I'd give you the rundown.

1st: It looks fantastic. It's a first person game and you can clearly see this studio has done first person before. Only once did I have a visual issue and it was actually the fact that a mat drop looked unique and when I picked it up it turned into a different mat. Pretty sure it's just because that difference isn't in the game yet. It also runs pretty well. At 1080p I didn't notice any slowdowns (I did see that my factory animation are reduced at a distance so they look a little like slow frame rates when they start becoming visible, but my local area was smooth so I'm pretty sure that's an optimization not any kind of framerate isue). I don't remember exactly which video card I have since I built the machine a couple years ago but I'm running something like a Radeon 460 on an i5.

2nd: There is a tiered tech tree. This is fine except that there is some pretty significant bottlenecking in the early tree. I think the tree needs to be balanced better. You run into two related issues early on. 1 - You can't build conveyer splitters/mergers until fairly late in the early tech tree (you have to get past the first major hurdle) and 2 - you can't build more power plants until that major hurdle. This is an issue because you have to run multiple mines to feed multiple smelters and constructors and it is very easy to hit your power ceiling (it "trips the fuse" and stops running EVERYTHING when this happens). In reality, 1 mine can feed two smelters and in a some cases, 1 smelter can feed 2 constructors very easily. But you are forced to make multiples of everything. This wouldn't be a big issue but some of the early tiers require quite a few factory made resources which leads to you sitting at your workbench making them yourself when the goal is to get you to automate everything.

3rd: Lots of glitches, but mostly ones that make life easier. IE conveyer belts and power lines can clip through the ground with no ill effects. Laying conveyer belts is super easy and they will automatically turn etc. I am not yet good at making anything like a clean/square layout yet. But there is also a bug that currently breaks some functionality of my game. At one of the later tiers available in the test, you get the ability to scan local resources for "research". There is also wreckage scattered around the planet. Normally the wreckage is guarded by a very dangerous creature that I don't currently have the resources to defeat. I ended up finding one piece of wreckage where I came in the opposite side they expected and after building a workbench and some screws was able to open the drop pod. Inside was a hard drive which it said I should "place in my scanner to recover the contents". Hard drives appear to be a source of "alternate blueprints" or secondary ways to make tech. For instance, screws are normally made from metal rods and metal rods are made from metal ingots. Normal workflow is mine->smelter->constructor->constructor (or workbench). This alternate blueprint would require twice the ingots, but allow mine->smelter->constructor. However every time I try to choose my reward (out of 3 choices) the game crashed. I tried this 3-4 times last night before finally going to bed and it crashed every time. This makes my scanner unusable.

4th: There are some seriously annoying interface issues. When out exploring, you often want to change between eating berries and nuts to heal up and carrying your shock stick or object scanner. There are not configurable hotkeys or boxes on the screen to assign as a quick bar. This is made worse because both of these things exist. There are letter hot keys for construction, destruction, flashlight, ore scanner, mail and you can switch between any of those and your shock prod weapon. There are number hotkeys which seem to be automatically assigned as you begin to be able to build certain things. Right now I have power poles, power lines, conveyor pylons and conveyor belts. But I have to go into my inventory (which doesn't pause the game) and manually drag and drop the items into my "hand slot". This is made worse by the fact that it's pretty particular what counts as making it into the slot and what doesn't. There is no snap area around the slot that works, you have to be directly over it.

These issues are most glaring when exploring. Oh and there are hotkeys for stack splitting, transferring whole stacks etc, but they don't always display them depending on what storage you are interfacing with and they don't work for instance with switching what is in your hand.

Other issue is that feeding power plants is currently manual. You can build a constructor or two to take leaves/wood and turn them into biomass and then turn the biomass in to biogas and then manually feed that into your power plants at the early tier, but you have to manually collect leaves and wood first...fortunately biogas lasts pretty long.

But issues aside as I started getting more tech I got better and having the mats on hand for each level. In fact once I got over the first speed bumps of not enough power and not enough conveyor control, I found I was able to race through almost all of the remaining tech tree until I had to build the space elevator.

Oh and exploration and death. Death sees you respawn back in your hub with nothing and you will have a compass pointer to a chest containing all your stuff from your previous life. Hopefully you have enough in stores at your base to at least build a zapper and head out to get your items.

So my verdict is: I would buy it for $20 no problem. I think $29.95 is a little steep of an ask right now, but would absolutely pay that amount for version 1.0. Their roadmap says the first goals will be fixing crashes etc and minor quality of life changes. Then they plan to start ramping up some of the unexplored resource tech trees (I found sulfer, quartz, and bauxite while out exploring which it seems currently do nothing.
 

Mortus

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Only got to play it for about 3 hours but had a blast. I didn't experience any real issues the entire time. It was quite well optimized for an alpha. There are some interface QoL changes that will be necessary, but overall it was a pleasant experience.

My only real complaint is the fact that the mining rig was so far down the tier 0 tree. Like when I'm building smelters, constructors, and belts before I can automate my mining, it feels like unnecessary hand-feeding. I guess you could say it is somewhat the same in Factorio, but in that game even your first drills can feed to a belt.
 

Tegid

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Only got to play it for about 3 hours but had a blast. I didn't experience any real issues the entire time. It was quite well optimized for an alpha. There are some interface QoL changes that will be necessary, but overall it was a pleasant experience.

My only real complaint is the fact that the mining rig was so far down the tier 0 tree. Like when I'm building smelters, constructors, and belts before I can automate my mining, it feels like unnecessary hand-feeding. I guess you could say it is somewhat the same in Factorio, but in that game even your first drills can feed to a belt.

I'd agree with this. Honestly I'd like Mining/Storage to be first, then add Smelting/Constructing/Conveyors. But I think the reason is that the portable mining rigs don't require power.

I also wanted to comment that there is currently a LOT less to make because honestly, it's a lot harder to set up to make anything because of the FPS aspect of the game. I think that part balances out nicely though.
 

Far Claws

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I've been watching this game closely since they first announced it, but missed the initial alpha invite. Unfortunately this weekend was a busy one for me and I didn't get to try out this weekend's Alpha, despite receiving a key. Thanks for writing up your thoughts on this. I love Factorio and Infinifactory, so this seems right up my alley.
 

Tegid

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I think they mentioned that this alpha weekend only gave access to the first three tiers of research and that Early Access will have six?
I've only been watching from a distance so far, though. I know this game is right up my alley, so I'm willing to wait for them to have something sell-able before I jump in.

So I didn't manage to make it to tier 3 this weekend, with 3 kids and a real Date Night with the wife I was lucky to play at all. Interestingly I'd say that a LOT of the lower tier stuff is ironically things you won't appreciate until you've put quite a few hours into the game. Lots of walls and ramps and platforms and base building stuff that I honestly don't know how to use properly. HOWEVER, I do appreciate that once you DO know how to play, you can be a lot smarter/better about how you build your base in the first place and use a lot of those things. But in my limited playtime, most of them were not so useful. This is one of the areas where playing multiplayer could make this game significantly more fun because you could have a person or two just dedicated to base layout and design in a way that isn't really feasible when trying to tech up in single player.

At the same time, there is quite a bit of content in the bottom tiers (there is technically a Tier 0 that is the tutorial area) so I think once they get the sulfur and quartz tech in (April is the timeframe suggested) there should be quite a bit of stuff to do.
 

Tegid

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I've got a First Look up on the game, though it only scratches the surface. I played a couple more hours afterwards and finally started getting into the meat of the early game.

Cool! FYI you can select the Milestone for upgrading BEFORE you have all the resources and it will leave on your screen what the needed resources are. You can also dump less than all into it and it will show you how much you have in place. It's pretty useful. You can also change your milestone at any time.
 
D

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I tried it this weekend as well and was a bit underwhelmed.

The best part was deploying the space elevator, it's just glorious.

The game loop just isn't working as is, my biggest gripe is I can't craft components anywhere, only at the craft bench. Crafting there was substantially faster then letting machines run, so I spent most of my five hours looking at the craft screen just holding down the "craft" button listening to the "tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink, tink."

And that only lead to me thinking of this song and having to stuck in my head:
https://youtu.be/bIKajSQ9DB0

That's just tedious and boring. They need to revamp it to be engaging, I found I had a ton of downtime and the power issues are too real. I felt like I was spinning my wheels most of the time. Oh, and copper not showing up on the ping thing, though it's a base item like iron? Fucking garbage. 45 minutes to learn the damn stuff was on the ridge beside my base. Like what the fuck guys. It looks too much like iron ore.

It's geared to be co-op it seems, and I won't be playing it co-op, as a solo effort the grind is too real. I think I'll be passing despite my initial enthusiasm.
 

Robotank

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KatherineOfSky (huge factorio person) recorded some multiplayer and I watched the first recording she published. Lets just say I am not digging the FPS nature of it.

I recommend thinking of it as Subnautica with automation.
KoS was also pretty awkward with the first person camera controls. It's not her home turf for recording and I think it made the first person aspects of the game look a bit rough as a result.
 

Tegid

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Having never played Subnautica that analogy doesn't help! :D

Well there is your first mistake. Subnautica is a pretty excellent experience throughout. It isn't perfect, but it's a LOT of fun.

But basically it's an exploration game with lots of cool things to discover/find out and some base building/resource management and gathering as part of the game. Right now I'm not sure the exploring really pays off as much as I expect it will later on. Subnautica was similar. At first it was a fun builder game but it really didn't progress and there were a bunch of bugs around building so it had a lot of issues. I stopped playing awhile and then went back when it was released as a 1.0 and had a lot more fun. Kind of the opposite of The Long Dark where it was actually more fun to just play the game in an empty world and try and figure out where everyone went and just survive and wasn't as fun when they actually put the rest of the game in (IMHO)

This game is similar really except that you can automate the resource gathering etc. I think the reason the smelters are slower than you at a workbench is to encourage you to go exploring. I got things set up churning out iron plates, iron bars and copper wire then went out to explore. Found myself a 2 new biomes, a drop pod, a few "WIP Items" (literally WIP in their names, but I'm guessing they are going to be key to exploring the Endgame). Each Biome then has a bunch of new stuff to explore (mobs, resources etc).

So don't think of it as a 3D Factorio. Think of it as an open world exploration game with a factory subgame and you'll have a good time. But YES, there are definitely pacing and balancing issues ESPECIALLY in the early game. But once I went exploring once and came back, I burned through almost all the available research with my stored items.
 

Magus`

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Hm, watching Mortus play through, my initial reaction might not have been a little hasty; it's looking more interesting than I thought...

e:

[url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=36990665#p36990665:32qu7tkv said:
Drizzt321[/url]":32qu7tkv]But Epic Store.
Yeah, with you there. I hope it's a temporary exclusive and not permanent.
 

Tegid

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Hm, watching Mortus play through, my initial reaction might not have been a little hasty; it's looking more interesting than I thought...

e:

[url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=36990665#p36990665:ju77sh2o said:
Drizzt321[/url]":ju77sh2o]But Epic Store.
Yeah, with you there. I hope it's a temporary exclusive and not permanent.

What's wrong with the Epic store? It seems like they are doing things right. Better payment to creators, seems pretty seamless for users. EA/Origin yeah I'll skip, but this one seems pretty good all around.
 

Magus`

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[url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=36991193#p36991193:pechfaoj said:
Tegid[/url]":pechfaoj]What's wrong with the Epic store?
Missing tons of features vs Steam and paying for exclusives to fuck over people on other marketplaces in a bid for market share.

I wouldn't mind it at all if developers charged more on Steam than Epic because of the lower cut by Epic; I'll happily pay more for the convenience of having my games in one place.
 

Drizzt321

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[url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=36991193#p36991193:2jko6ol1 said:
Tegid[/url]":2jko6ol1]What's wrong with the Epic store?
Missing tons of features vs Steam and paying for exclusives to fuck over people on other marketplaces in a bid for market share.

I wouldn't mind it at all if developers charged more on Steam than Epic because of the lower cut by Epic; I'll happily pay more for the convenience of having my games in one place.

I'm waiting on Epic, seeing how it all turns out. But yea, it IS more convenient to have it all in one place.
 

Tegid

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[url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=36991193#p36991193:2tup88p9 said:
Tegid[/url]":2tup88p9]What's wrong with the Epic store?
Missing tons of features vs Steam and paying for exclusives to fuck over people on other marketplaces in a bid for market share.

I wouldn't mind it at all if developers charged more on Steam than Epic because of the lower cut by Epic; I'll happily pay more for the convenience of having my games in one place.

Honestly I'm not upset about exclusives at this point. They have so much ground to make up on Steam that I respect the value that exclusives represent to them. As a primarily single player game player, I haven't noticed any significant missing features. I went there, chose download, it downloaded and I played. It was pretty straightforward.
 

Tegid

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Drizzt321

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[url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=36993103#p36993103:363wv2jk said:
Tegid[/url]":363wv2jk]I haven't noticed any significant missing features.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Steam/comments ... _services/

Thanks, that is a handy list! It confirms I don't care about the majority of the items on the list. There are definitely a few I do care about though so I will keep them in mind.

Thanks! Too bad it's a compressed artifacty JPG.

Likewise, I don't do a lot of multi-player or friends/social stuff on Steam anyway. A bit, but only a small bit. VR, I do a bit, so that's a point, but it's still so early in VR I mostly am not playing VR games, so I'm fine without the Store/App supporting it.

I do like the Refund mechanic for Steam. Only used it once (Waking Mars) when the game was just NOT what I was expecting and I didn't play it much. But for me that's the exception, and personally I can afford if I can't get a refund (although annoyed). Still, I think I'll wait to see how Epic Store goes.
 

Magus`

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[url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=36993927#p36993927:1oy1qt0k said:
Tegid[/url]":1oy1qt0k]Thanks, that is a handy list! It confirms I don't care about the majority of the items on the list. There are definitely a few I do care about though so I will keep them in mind.
Unfortunately there are enough where I do that makes Epic a non-starter for me :)

Anywho, not to derail the thread too much; if this turns out to be timed exclusive only I will probably pick it up.

e: just read it's a 12 month exclusive... see you in 2020! :(
 

Tegid

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[url=http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=36993927#p36993927:2glivpcb said:
Tegid[/url]":2glivpcb]Thanks, that is a handy list! It confirms I don't care about the majority of the items on the list. There are definitely a few I do care about though so I will keep them in mind.
Unfortunately there are enough where I do that makes Epic a non-starter for me :)

Anywho, not to derail the thread too much; if this turns out to be timed exclusive only I will probably pick it up.

e: just read it's a 12 month exclusive... see you in 2020! :(

I was just coming here to tell you that. Though the video explaining this said there is no guarantee they decide to release elsewhere. I'm guessing they will.
 
Initial impression was fairly good. Struggled with some first-person view challenges (plopping large buildings) and identifying the information needed to manage input/output. Also, apparently shift+click should move stacks - that was annoying to find out on Monday. pure/impure veins wasn't clear early on. I was able to get my space elevator up and start demolishing and refining the factory before the weekend ended. The weakest part of the game for me was the environment and exploration (not very engaging) and fairly inaccessible coal spawns.

The Epic store exclusivity is mildly annoying, but with Steam, EA's Origin, UbiSoft's uplay already it is hardly worth complaining about (monopolies are bad and at least it isn't a publisher exclusive platform like Ubi/Origin). The exclusivity appears tied to the Early Access and not the full game release (at this time).
 

Tegid

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The wife is away next week and I'm seriously considering whether I want to pick this up or not. On the one hand, I stand by my contention that $30 is pretty high for early access. But I can almost certainly get that much value out of it. I'm also pretty certain it will occupy me for about 1 week and I'll be happy to set it aside for awhile.
 

Tegid

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Today's the day for Early Access. Sadly I'm out of town for business. So I won't get to play until tomorrow. I am sad.

I ended up picking it up and played for a few hours last night. Got the Space Elevator and made the first stage of it. Then I got coal power which is a HUGE upgrade, but so far away from my starting location.

Big news! Shift-Click in your inventory will swap that item into your hands if it makes sense to do so AND you can simply hit tab while running, click the item while still running, hit tab again and make the switch.
 

Tegid

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So I've played a bit more, but I clearly getting to the point where I need to tear everything down and start over again with foundations and more central planning. Not start the game over, but start the layout over. The "must automate making everything" hump in this game is kind of rough, because unlike Factorio, assemblers take up SO much power, that they pretty much need coal to work (or a dedicated biomass burner) and biomass burners are inherently manual. Sure you can process leaves or wood into biomass in constructors, or biomass into biogas, but that's a LOT of power just to generate the fuel to make power and you still have to manually deliver the power to the generators.

So when you want to start building assemblies (items that require two materials to make), you DON'T have coal yet (Coal requires the Space Elevator and you need a LOT of reinforced plate and rotors for that) and that means you are still making Biomass Generators. So your base becomes a kludge by necessity. I'd like it if they allowed an upgrade to biomass burners to allow auto-feeding. Right now there is a big "manual crafting" hump to get to coal.

But now I'm ready to really start automating with the output of (soon to be 3) coal power plants (might actually get up to 6) and not unlimited, but much less limited power. So again, I feel like I need to rip everything down and start again. Fortunately iron plate becomes a lot less useful in leveling, so I have plenty to build foundations, walkways, walls etc with. Iron Rod is WAY more important than plate as the game moves forward FYI.

I did find another pod and was able to actually benefit from the Hard Drive, though in this case I didn't feel like there was a HUGE benefit honestly.
 
I'm also getting to the "rebuild it all" stage. I have the space elevator, but I'm tired of manually crafting plates and rods, and I'm bottlenecked on iron, so I decided to put down foundations and get organized. I think I'm going to put down a second iron miner, and 4 smelteries feeding constructors for rods and plates before I move to stage 3 and go for coal.
 

Tegid

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I'm also getting to the "rebuild it all" stage. I have the space elevator, but I'm tired of manually crafting plates and rods, and I'm bottlenecked on iron, so I decided to put down foundations and get organized. I think I'm going to put down a second iron miner, and 4 smelteries feeding constructors for rods and plates before I move to stage 3 and go for coal.

I have 3 iron miners going already. 1 for rods, 1 for plates and then 1 for plates and screws to make reinforced plates.
 
I've been playing and wondering if some of the hard-drive discovery alternate recipes are mutually exclusive. That is, for example, if I choose Stitched Iron Plate (copper wire + iron plate => reinforced iron plate) over Iron Screws (iron ingots -> screws), will I be able to choose Iron Screws at a later time?

I've been trying to go back and get all the alternate recipes, and can't seem to get some of the earlier ones.