CyberPower UPS - bad?

Wrakkenruan · Jun 23, 2023

Got one of these, probably rather older, ~4-5 years maybe - can't find my records just now.

Anyway, it completely drops battery power outputs instantly upon the CyberPower panel self-test initiation (or a power outage - my first clue - zero run time). I.e., communicating with the computer via USB, PowerPanel says all is well, UPS functioning correctly and as expected; start self-test and buzz/click/ computer off. Pulled the batteries and they show 12.6 and 12.7v. I think it should be something over 13.5v, maybe, based on numbers printed on the batteries - but I'm not an expert on this.

Is the box likely bad now? So not worth new batteries? Save the batteries for another of the several of these that I have around the house? Get new batteries? It's all bad, throw away the box and recycle the batteries?

Thanks for your help.

Wrakkenruan · Jun 23, 2023

fwiw, guess I'm thinking even low voltage batteries (but still over the minimum 12v) should keep things going even a few seconds, if not minutes, and that the instant crash and turn-off is a sign the box is bad... (?)

Andrewcw · Jun 23, 2023

The Lead acid battery goes bad after like 3-5 years naturally some longer but assume yours are not of that type. Your batteries might show 12V output but under load it'll drop rapidly. Now is it worth $70 for replacement batteries?

Ligushka · Jun 23, 2023

I had a Cyberpower desktop UPS exhibit the same behavior, even after a replacement battery. Furthermore, a different model (smaller capacity but with AVR) failed after a power outage and didn't turn itself back on when utility power was restored - which necessitated a trip to the colo datacenter to simply press the damn power button.

Junk it and buy a more reputable brand. I'm personally never buying a Cyberpower product again.

Wrakkenruan · Jun 23, 2023

I've already got the replacement unit in from Costco; for the price ($125+tax for a 1500 VA unit with USB-C on the front - basically the old unit updated just a bit) I've been happy enough with the CyberPower, but they don't last so long - basically for the warranty period and I'm buying a new one soon after. I've always been interested in getting new batteries to keep the old ones going longer, but it's never seemed worthwhile in that I get new electronics plus new batteries for just a small amount more - and a new warranty just in case...

If I could find a better brand for not much more, I'd be happy to try it/them. All I can remember using other than CyberPower is APC, and APC seems in the same ballpark of price and quality from what I recall.

Oh yeah, sealed lead acid batteries in the unit - qty 2.

I'm tossing the old box and putting the old batteries in recycle... Thanks for the input, y'all.

(new unit)

quarlie · Jun 24, 2023

Ligushka said:
Junk it and buy a more reputable brand. I'm personally never buying a Cyberpower product again.

What brand do you recommend?

continuum · Jun 24, 2023

Can't speak for others, but we're mostly going to www.refurbups.com and buying refurbished APC Smart-UPS units.

AndrewZ · Jun 24, 2023

I have 2 Cyberpower 1250s. I replaced the batteries after 3 years. Both test as good as new.

Wrakkenruan · Jun 24, 2023

Just noticing the Ars "age" of respondents so far... Do we win a prize for oldest group?

DaveJ · Jun 25, 2023

AndrewZ said:
I have 2 Cyberpower 1250s. I replaced the batteries after 3 years. Both test as good as new.

No problems here as well. I've had CyberPower units on my workstation and servers for years and have had few issues. All of them have had multiple battery replacements over the years but have worked well.

AndrewZ · Jun 25, 2023

Wrakkenruan said:
Just noticing the Ars "age" of respondents so far... Do we win a prize for oldest group?

I joined to to learn hour to overclock a celeron 300 on a Abit BH6. Man, I got years out of that system. I upgraded everything on it twice. And ran SETI@Home.

Axl · Jul 9, 2023

SInce I'm part of the 23Y club, and have a bunch of 6 year old CyberPower UPSs, some with recently replaced battery sets, I'll chime in. I got out the DMM and tested all the failing batteries - some of the units would power a 30W load for ten seconds, some for a second, some for no time at all. Some would die the minute the plug was pulled. Voltage level matters - hugely. All the batteries are in pairs, and they never had the same levels. 14V is good. 12V is already way too low. A 14V + 12V might get you the few seconds of runtime I saw. A 12V and a 10V might get you one second, or less. Anything less is instant outage. A 14V and a 0V would probably be an instant outage, but it's not a combination I saw (or bothered to create).

With good batteries my Cyberpowers work, but I liked APC better. Cyberpower wattage monitoring is terrible - it only registers above ~24W, and it registers in 8-9W increments. Not nearly as precise as the APCs I have with the feature. If you remove a Cyberpower front panel for battery replacement, good luck getting it back on with the USB ports still plugged in (not that they really charge much of anything anyway).

If you want to save a few bucks on Cyberpower replacement batteries and extend the useful life of an already purchased UPS, though, MightyMax batteries might be worth a look.

AndrewZ · Jul 10, 2023

I used to love APC but they moved manufacturing to China, and quality went to crap. They got a terrible tear down review. You could see the design and workmanship was borderline dangerous.

continuum · Jul 10, 2023

Was that APC Back-UPS line or Smart-UPS Line that that teardown is for? I agree I generally wouldn't touch the Back-UPS line at all, and even for Smart-UPS, I'd buy a refurb from RefurbUPS.com anyway not a new one...

That said our experience with Tripp-Lite and Cyberpower is even worse so...

Wheels Of Confusion · Jul 10, 2023

AndrewZ said:
I used to love APC but they moved manufacturing to China, and quality went to crap. They got a terrible tear down review. You could see the design and workmanship was borderline dangerous.

This might explain my recent experience. I had a 1200W APC running desktop duty for years without issue. I hand it down to my NAS and WiFi mesh node after getting a beefier one for the desktop, and suddenly it can't return to service after being powered down without removing the battery every time. The battery reads a full charge, and can run for hours in a blackout (usually turn it off due to the warning beeps) but trying to turn the unit on yields a brief flash of the screen and nothing. Take the battery out, plug the unit in, it comes right up. Slide the battery in and it hums along fine.

continuum · Jul 10, 2023

Often that's a sign of a failing battery that hasn't quite failed yet.

Wheels Of Confusion · Jul 17, 2023

Hm. Just had another opportunity to "test" it under live conditions.
The estimated runtime on the display is being optimistic to the tune of 3-4 times reality, judging by how long it said it had at first and versus 2 hours later, with no load but its own display running. Still need to yank the battery then plug cycle the unit and re-insert the battery to get it to run again. When I grab the UPS housing to do all that, the back part of the upper vent is really warm even though nothing is "working."

HO · Jul 19, 2023

I endorse Eaton.
I recently tested my 5115 UPS w/ 5 year old Yuasa batteries. Run time for a 200w light bulb (not quite 2X my typical load) was 7 minutes so I ordered a fresh set. This will be the third battery set for the Eaton so maybe I'll be looking at replacing the unit in a couple of years. No complaints at all with the 5115 other than the web interface is dated and I have to shut off the power alarm manually.

Visigoth · Jul 19, 2023

Wheels Of Confusion said:
Hm. Just had another opportunity to "test" it under live conditions.
The estimated runtime on the display is being optimistic to the tune of 3-4 times reality, judging by how long it said it had at first and versus 2 hours later, with no load but its own display running. Still need to yank the battery then plug cycle the unit and re-insert the battery to get it to run again. When I grab the UPS housing to do all that, the back part of the upper vent is really warm even though nothing is "working."

The runtime estimate likely is off due to it needing to run a recalibration cycle. Since it is likely basing the values off of a new battery and not a real calculation based on the current battery. So could be the battery is going bad and will run on it, but not all the cells in it are working now.

I'm pretty much in the habit of swapping out with new batteries in my units every 3-4 years. I'd have expected them to last longer especially since there's been no long power outages in the last few years (knocks on wood) but even still they do go bad. More annoying is when the self-checks come back good but when there is a short power outage everything drops since the battery really isn't good. Thus why I just swap them regardless of what it's own self-test says.

And yeah, I mainly use APC Smart-UPS units for my stuff. I have a Back-UPS on something that I'd like to not lose power but it's not really critical if it does so just went the cheaper route for it.

von Chaps · Jul 20, 2023

I run a test once a month where I cut power to the UPS for 1 hour and monitor what happens. My runtime estimate is 2 hours based on load and, after the 1 hour test, sure enough I am down to more or less 1 hour remaining. Whilst I don't take this as gospel, I am thinking that I'm all good for now. I am wondering if running down to 50% is enough to keep the unit callibrated regarding runtime.

This test doesn't evaluate whether the UPS could cold-start with a completely dead battery which is the problem WoC had.

It seems to me that this approach should catch a dying UPS, in which case, I'm happy to carry on using CyberPower for now. Perhaps something like this makes them acceptable in what seems to be a shrinking domestic market.

FWIW, my auto-test is implemented in Home Assistant, so I don't need to do anything except observe the notifications. It only runs if I am at home (just in case it all dies when the power goes off).

thrillgore · Jul 20, 2023

I've burned through all my CyberPower UPSes over the past two years, all dying almost after the warranty ends. They are also making them near impossible to change batteries for, either they have no door, or the batteries aren't sold. They're Amazon trash.

Buy APC. You'll spend more, but APC is worth it.

I also, many years ago, worked a contract on APC's website redesign. They had the same fugly design from the 2000s before we came in and fixed it.

Xenocrates · Jul 20, 2023

thrillgore said:
batteries aren't sold

The batteries are fairly standard SLA designs with bridge jumpers and foam tape. IDK why everyone is buying branded batteries rather than getting same form factor replacements from brands like Duracell and transferring the jumpers. Unless you're buying a Li based UPS, they're pretty trivial to source batteries for.

Then again, I've been rocking APC Smart UPS 1200 and 1500's that I bought with bad batteries for ~30 each for the past 5 years, and have done a lot of battery replacements over the years for APC, Cyberpower, and Tripplite UPSes, so I'm not particularly brand loyal, beyond not typically buying the consumer grade units. My rule of thumb is that if it's got an expandable battery architecture, then it's probably built well enough to survive long term use.

Auguste_Fivaz · Aug 3, 2023

My COSTCO Cyberpower PST150XCU (1500) died last night, one loud alarm then down. Fired it up this morning, battery indicator went from 0% to 5% and it tripped again. I put it on my bench where I have good clean power and turned it on again, same thing. The unit showed voltage at my desk read 120 VAC, on my bench 130 VAC, which is what I'd expect out of the isolation transformer and power filter. So, it wasn't low voltage at the desktop that caused the failure.
Battery A read 6 VDC, while B read 12VDC after the last failure. A bit warm when I removed them. I wonder if there was a larger heat issue as the negative terminal's shrink tubing was hardened and the terminal itself didn't want to come off easily. I'll be shopping for a replacement as this unit hasn't been reliable.

Wheels Of Confusion · Aug 7, 2023

Xenocrates said:
The batteries are fairly standard SLA designs with bridge jumpers and foam tape. IDK why everyone is buying branded batteries rather than getting same form factor replacements from brands like Duracell and transferring the jumpers. Unless you're buying a Li based UPS, they're pretty trivial to source batteries for.

Speaking of which, I've been looking into it and my unit runs on a pair of 7Ah batteries.
Would it throw anything off if I bumped those up to 9Ah (largest capacity I can get in the same form factor)?

von Chaps · Aug 7, 2023

Wheels Of Confusion said:
Speaking of which, I've been looking into it and my unit runs on a pair of 7Ah batteries.
Would it throw anything off if I bumped those up to 9Ah (largest capacity I can get in the same form factor)?

Doubt it would affect the charging/discharging ability - other than in the way you intend.

Might affect the calculated runtime - I don't know how adaptive that is or whether it assumes a set capacity. Maybe a few charge/discharge cycles would fix those numbers, maybe not.

Xenocrates · Aug 7, 2023

There is a chance that the unit is designed with certain duty cycles, and the 9AH may end up with enough extra run time to build up heat past what it's designed for, if running at nearly their rated VA. That's part of why I generally only like to buy new or refurb UPS's with an external battery connector, and oversize ones I pick up second hand versus their application.

Kyuu · Aug 8, 2023

For what it's worth, I am migrating my entire organization off of APC UPSes. As they reach end of life, they are being replaced with Vertiv Liebert Lithium-ion units. APC's Lithium-ion units cost more for less capacity. Assuming the electronics and battery last at least 10 years, it will be more than worth the cost as batteries shouldn't need replacement before the entire unit is end of life, so far fewer touches, few or no premature battery failures (hopefully), and they are so, so much easier to handle than lead-acid.

As for Cyberpower, those are used only for throwaway UPSes to go under peoples desks, never for actual critical infrastructure. We wouldn't even use them for that if it was up to me. Those cheap units fail early and often.

Wheels Of Confusion · Aug 8, 2023

It's light-duty stuff. My NAS and an Orbi satellite unit are the only things on that UPS. I just figured, since I'll be replacing the old batteries anyway, might as well pack in a little more power? The equivalent branded pack is an APCRBC124 (2x9Ah) versus my existing, worn-out APCRBC123 (2x7Ah).

Kyuu · Aug 8, 2023

I mean, it can't hurt, except for what Xenocrates mentioned about duty cycles. Most likely it would be fine. I would recommend doing a run-down test after it fully charges, to make sure there's no funny behavior, excessive heat, etc. Plus you'll know just about exactly how long it will stay up during an outage.

Xelas · Aug 8, 2023

Does anyone know of a good (and cheap) way to manage or at least monitor UPSs through the cloud? APC has their "SmartConnect" thing, which is fairly terrible but at least it exists. Cyberpower has a cloud portal, but their hardware is iffy. We have hundreds of very small sites on independent networks. We don't have servers/PCs onsite to install agents on (networks are mainly for PoS systems).

continuum · Aug 8, 2023

Unfortunately no idea on a universal one. I assume, like you've seen so far, it's all platform-specific?

Kyuu · Aug 9, 2023

Cloud-based SNMP monitoring is a thing, but I'm not aware of any that work without installing an agent on something in the site's network to push the data to the cloud service. If there's really nothing at the sites that can run an agent, you're in a bit of a tough spot. Going all-in with a vendor that has their own proprietary cloud service, like APC's SmartConnect, may be your only bet.

rodalpho · Aug 9, 2023

To counter other peoples' personal experiences, I have a bunch of cyberpower UPS's and they all work fine for years and years. I can't speak to them in the datacenter or enterprise, but for your desktop or whatever, they work great. If you need a UPS for your CPAP machine or anything else medically critical, use whatever the manufacturer recommends, probably don't want a stacked-coupon special deal for that.

Kyuu · Aug 9, 2023

I will caveat that my experience with Cyberpower UPSes is limited strictly to the cheapest of their desktop models. It may very well be that their higher-end offerings are perfectly cromulent.

But just keep in mind that APC and Cyberpower aren't the only ones out there. As I mentioned before, I am migrating my organization to Vertiv Liebert models for more critical infrastructure (specifically their lithium-ion offerings). While obviously I don't yet have good historical data for their performance, things are going well so far.

MR2DI4 · Aug 9, 2023

My company has been deploying simple Cyberpower 12VDC battery backups for our ONTs for years and they seem to be holding up well. Only thing that goes bad are the batteries after about 5 years or so. Replacement takes just a minute with a standard size 7.2Ah SLA battery.

rodalpho · Aug 9, 2023

Well sure, batteries are consumed when used. I don't have the cheapest of the cheap, I've got a 1000VA and 1500VA with sine-wave, but they were not at all expensive. Your mileage may obviously vary, but I do think they have a place under your desk and shouldn't be dismissed out of hand.

bkaral · Aug 9, 2023

I use only old APC units and Belkins. Built like tanks, and they just keep going for a long, long time. Do people assume because something is new it'll last longer?

von Chaps · Aug 10, 2023

bkaral said:
Do people assume because something is new it'll last longer?

Quite the opposite in my case.

Auguste_Fivaz · Aug 12, 2023

I know very little about and so was reading up on the Jackery Explorer 1000 in the NYT wirecutter reviews. I was wondering if this $1,000 device with a power strip could also act as a UPS? The Amazon blurb says they can be used while charging, so if left plugged in it would give much better run time than the much cheaper UPS. A CyberPower EC850 ($106 on Amazon) for example has power filters and 12 outlets and about 10 minutes of runtime for the NAS cluster I run.

continuum · Aug 12, 2023

Hand off time would be the issue, but if you're always using it and it can be used while charging, could be worth a try?

CyberPower UPS - bad?

Ars Praefectus

Ars Praefectus

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Praefectus

Ars Praefectus

Ars Scholae Palatinae

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Praefectus

Ars Tribunus Militum

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Praetorian

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Scholae Palatinae

Ars Tribunus Angusticlavius

Ars Centurion

Ars Tribunus Militum

Ars Tribunus Militum

Ars Praefectus

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Centurion

Ars Tribunus Militum

Ars Tribunus Militum

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Tribunus Militum

Ars Praefectus

Ars Legatus Legionis

Ars Tribunus Militum

Ars Praefectus

Ars Tribunus Militum

Ars Praefectus

Ars Praefectus

Ars Tribunus Militum

Ars Centurion

Ars Praefectus

Ars Legatus Legionis