Starlink. It’s the internet, from space!

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MaHawkma

MaHawkma

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  • #6
    Paladin said:
    Since you're waiting for the stuff, why don't you describe your current situation? Are you in the middle of nowhere and can't get good service now? Or do you have decent internet and hope for better? Or is this going to be for a separate location?
    Click to expand...

    Sure,

    I am not in the middle of nowhere but am located just on the outskirts of my current local(head a couple miles north and it would be corn field city). I do have two "choices" for high speed access: DSL and cable. I have the cable option which is decent connection(150/10)and I used to be happy with the company but in the last five or so years they have been slowly raising their prices and have implemented a data cap(which costs us even more money as I have to pay for extra data else we would hit the cap every month). The company that provides DSL is expanding their fiber network in the city but we won't be seeing it anytime soon where I am at because all of that stuff is buried and they are going after easier, more profitable deployments(I've asked and they have said, maybe, some time in the future. . . ). So, I am interested tying it out because:

    1. It could be a possible replacement for my current connection (cheaper, no cap, possible greater speeds as they improve sat coverage)
    2. We are looking to move in the near future and having this service would open up the possibility of moving into the sticks which we have been contemplating but have held off because crappy internet
    3. As Frennzy put it, I am also just darn curious and want to see how well it works

    Ultimately, it will probably end up being a backup and I will use it as a fail over as from what I have been reading, its not quite there yet in terms of uptime. Also, if it is just really horrible, you do have 30 days to return and get a refund. So I will have that going for me, which is nice. . .
     
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    sryan2k1

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  • #10
    Paladin said:
    I'm curious too, I can't see how it will be great but it might be good enough. Maybe. I'll be interested to hear how it goes.
    Click to expand...



    "Starlink isn't for people who hate Comcast, it's for people who wish they could get Comcast to hate"


    I'd love it if they had an on demand plan, we just had a 3 day power outage and DOCSIS was offline after a few and our cell coverage here is brutally bad. I would have gladly paid $200 for "X days" of emergency internet.
     
    Paladin

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  • #11
    Hehe, their 'on demand' plan is buy it and then only use it on demand. ;) If it's worth it to you when you really need it, maybe it is worth it to have it when you don't need it? Do they make you send the hardware back if you let the service lapse? Or do you have to buy it up front? Your average fiber to the home provider doesn't come rip out the fiber when you cancel the service, they just leave almost everything there until someone else comes along and pays for it. Not the same situation with Starlink but I can imagine it being like that if you have service for long enough and then cancel, they might let you keep the gear in hopes you might sign up again later.
     
    Paladin

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  • #13
    Yeah, that would be nice but I don't think it will happen any time in the reasonable future. They would have to either overbuild for potential customers or do something to manage who can come online in the case of a large scale outage in an area. Some kind of big fire, storm, earthquake or regional internet outage would result in thousands and thousands of sudden users coming online and their setup is already stretched for capacity and they face a very limited ability to grow with basically everyone else involved in 'space stuff' kinda pissed at them for adding more orbital junk.

    I would simply look into LTE internet for backup and if your area is that bad, check with the provider on what they can do to improve it. Then again, a fixed LTE connected router might get much better service since it could have much better antennas and stuff.
     
    stevenkan

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  • #14
    sryan2k1 said:
    Yeah I want dishy installed, online all the time getting firmware/etc and in an outage just send me to a captive portal to pay.
    Click to expand...

    Here are Starlink's pre-order terms of service. Key terms that I saw after a very quick read (e.g. read this slower than I did):

    When Services become available in your area. . . You authorize SpaceX to charge your approved payment method for (a) a one-time purchase price on the balance of your Starlink Kit and any accessories, including shipping & handling and applicable taxes; and (b) monthly recurring charges, including applicable taxes, for the Services selected in your Order, starting 14 days after SpaceX ships your Starlink Kit.
    Click to expand...

    You can stop the recurring monthly payment and cancel Services at any time via your Starlink account located within the Starlink Customer Portal.
    Click to expand...

    It looks like the 14-day waiting period is for initial provisioning. It doesn't say how long re-activation would take.

    But it looks like the risk is limited to the $500 dish and the first month's service fee of $99.

    I'd contribute a $25 donation to fund someone's experiment on this. Turn it on, turn it off, and then turn it back on and see how fast you get provisioned.

    Who's with me?
     
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    sryan2k1

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  • #15
    We live in a slight depression and the nearest VZW tower is about a mile north on private property (Country club/golf course), so it's a rather short tower. When we lost power for 3 days that tower went offline after a few hours and we had like....no data. Like can't load the google homepage even though it shows 4G no data.


    AT&T is only marginally better so it doesn't make sense to pay a cellular carrier for maybe once every few years, I'd invest in Starlink though.
     
    stevenkan

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  • #20
    Hap

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  • #21
    I currently have AT&T fiber, but it is literally the only option. I have Starlink on order as a backup provider. We live in tornado country and we have exactly one road to where we live. If one comes across the only road in and takes out the utility poles - then we have no power, no phone, no cell service and no internet. We do have gas generators with stored gas as well as a solar generator with 200W of panels.
     
    stevenkan

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  • #22
    Hap said:
    I currently have AT&T fiber, but it is literally the only option. I have Starlink on order as a backup provider. We live in tornado country and we have exactly one road to where we live. If one comes across the only road in and takes out the utility poles - then we have no power, no phone, no cell service and no internet. We do have gas generators with stored gas as well as a solar generator with 200W of panels.
    Click to expand...

    When's your estimated delivery date?
     
    malor

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  • #23
    Hap said:
    I currently have AT&T fiber, but it is literally the only option. I have Starlink on order as a backup provider. We live in tornado country and we have exactly one road to where we live. If one comes across the only road in and takes out the utility poles - then we have no power, no phone, no cell service and no internet. We do have gas generators with stored gas as well as a solar generator with 200W of panels.
    Click to expand...

    200 watts? Isn't that, like, one panel?
     
    Hap

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  • #24
    malor said:
    Hap said:
    I currently have AT&T fiber, but it is literally the only option. I have Starlink on order as a backup provider. We live in tornado country and we have exactly one road to where we live. If one comes across the only road in and takes out the utility poles - then we have no power, no phone, no cell service and no internet. We do have gas generators with stored gas as well as a solar generator with 200W of panels.
    Click to expand...

    200 watts? Isn't that, like, one panel?
    Click to expand...

    Two. They are standalone and not installed, they're part of the solar generator kit.

    Don't have an installation date yet.
     
    stevenkan

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  • #28
    Hap said:
    If I had a fixed solar installation, I agree. It's meant to be portable, solely for the solar generator. I don't have a Jackery, but what I have is very similar to this: Jackery Solar Generator 1000, Explorer 1000 and 2X SolarSaga 100W with 3x110V/1000W AC Outlets, Solar Mobile Lithium Battery Pack for Outdoor RV/Van Camping
    Click to expand...

    Interesting! I'd be interested in something like this, if there were a model at 1/10th the capacity, 1/5th the price, and for semi-permanent installation (e.g. to power a camera and cellular router).
     
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    sryan2k1

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  • #29
    The whole "Lithium as a generator in a nice package" is why it's so ungodly expensive.

    If all you need is 100w, tons of companies make 100w kits.

    100w panel with charge controller $158:
    https://www.amazon.com/Renogy-Monocryst ... CNFRM?th=1


    12v AGM car battery ~$220


    If your electronics can take ~11-15VDC boom, you're done.

    If not you'll need a DC-DC converter, or an AC inverter, a 100W AC inverter on amazon is $17



    So you're looking at $400, a bit more sane, but the bulk of the cost is the battery, you could go smaller if you needed less capacity.
     
    Frennzy

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  • #30
    So you're looking at $400, a bit more sane, but the bulk of the cost is the battery, you could go smaller if you needed less capacity.


    Replying to "Starlink. It’s the internet, from space!":
    Click to expand...


    Pro-tip. Maybe canvasse your local healthcare facilities for out-of-date deep cycle batteries. They are legally obligated (AFAIK across the US) to replace those on a strict schedule, since they run life-saving equipment during power outages.

    Friend of mine did that for his cabin up in ID. The hospital IT folks were happy to just have him come pick them up, because disposal fees are outrageous. To the best of my knowledge, they lasted him at least 5 years.
     
    stevenkan

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  • #31
    Frennzy said:
    So you're looking at $400, a bit more sane, but the bulk of the cost is the battery, you could go smaller if you needed less capacity.


    Replying to "Starlink. It’s the internet, from space!":
    Click to expand...


    Pro-tip. Maybe canvasse your local healthcare facilities for out-of-date deep cycle batteries. They are legally obligated (AFAIK across the US) to replace those on a strict schedule, since they run life-saving equipment during power outages.

    Friend of mine did that for his cabin up in ID. The hospital IT folks were happy to just have him come pick them up, because disposal fees are outrageous. To the best of my knowledge, they lasted him at least 5 years.
    Click to expand...

    Oooooh. I'd be all over this. What are the magic words that I should use?
     
    stevenkan

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  • #32
    sryan2k1 said:
    The whole "Lithium as a generator in a nice package" is why it's so ungodly expensive.

    If all you need is 100w, tons of companies make 100w kits.

    100w panel with charge controller $158:
    https://www.amazon.com/Renogy-Monocryst ... CNFRM?th=1
    Click to expand...

    Nice! If I can pair that with some free batteries like Frennzy is suggesting, that would totally work.

    edit: sorry to take this OT, as this has nothing to do with Starlink any more. I should transplant this sidebar over here.
     
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    xoa

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  • #33
    Since this seems to be the current Starlink thread, I just want to note since I somehow missed it myself: at some point over the last few months a firmware update to Dishy added DHCP option 121 (as defined in RFC 3442) to supply additional routes beyond the default. In particular, it's now handling the necessary stats routing itself:
    Code: 
    Option: (121) Classless Static Route
    Length: 23
     192.168.100.1/32-0.0.0.0
     [ipv4]/32-0.0.0.0
     default-[ipv4]
Option: (255) End
    So there is no longer any need to fiddle around with manually setting up a static route in order to get statistics with a 3rd party router. That may not have been a big deal but this is still a nice additional bit of polish that I'm pleasantly surprised by, making 3rd party routers first class. They didn't really need to do that, and typical crummy ISPs likely wouldn't and just say "use our junk or you're on your own".

    It would be nice still if there was some sort of status info available on the web, and the app flow with your own network still is non-existent as far as I can tell. Hopefully that improves too. Still though, along with them having IPv6 up it's nice to see it getting more roughed edges sanded down for general usage.
     
    Kethinov

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  • #35
    Paladin said:
    Hehe, their 'on demand' plan is buy it and then only use it on demand. ;) If it's worth it to you when you really need it, maybe it is worth it to have it when you don't need it? Do they make you send the hardware back if you let the service lapse? Or do you have to buy it up front? Your average fiber to the home provider doesn't come rip out the fiber when you cancel the service, they just leave almost everything there until someone else comes along and pays for it. Not the same situation with Starlink but I can imagine it being like that if you have service for long enough and then cancel, they might let you keep the gear in hopes you might sign up again later.
    Click to expand...


    sryan2k1 said:
    Paladin said:
    I'm curious too, I can't see how it will be great but it might be good enough. Maybe. I'll be interested to hear how it goes.
    Click to expand...



    "Starlink isn't for people who hate Comcast, it's for people who wish they could get Comcast to hate"


    I'd love it if they had an on demand plan, we just had a 3 day power outage and DOCSIS was offline after a few and our cell coverage here is brutally bad. I would have gladly paid $200 for "X days" of emergency internet.
    Click to expand...

    I'm in this boat as well. I am interested in Starlink as a backup internet connection. I would be in shut_up_and_take_my_money.jpg territory if we could confirm it is easy to shut off and turn back on on demand. I'd be more than happy to pay for a full month of service anytime I need it if my primary connection goes down. My hope is I can have it shut off 10 to 11 months of the year and then if a bad storm comes, all I have to do is get on their website on my phone, push a button, and bam my Starlink connection is active and they've charged me $100. No brainer.
     
    malor

    malor

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  • #36
    Kethinov said:
    Paladin said:
    Hehe, their 'on demand' plan is buy it and then only use it on demand. ;) If it's worth it to you when you really need it, maybe it is worth it to have it when you don't need it? Do they make you send the hardware back if you let the service lapse? Or do you have to buy it up front? Your average fiber to the home provider doesn't come rip out the fiber when you cancel the service, they just leave almost everything there until someone else comes along and pays for it. Not the same situation with Starlink but I can imagine it being like that if you have service for long enough and then cancel, they might let you keep the gear in hopes you might sign up again later.
    Click to expand...


    sryan2k1 said:
    Paladin said:
    I'm curious too, I can't see how it will be great but it might be good enough. Maybe. I'll be interested to hear how it goes.
    Click to expand...



    "Starlink isn't for people who hate Comcast, it's for people who wish they could get Comcast to hate"


    I'd love it if they had an on demand plan, we just had a 3 day power outage and DOCSIS was offline after a few and our cell coverage here is brutally bad. I would have gladly paid $200 for "X days" of emergency internet.
    Click to expand...

    I'm in this boat as well. I am interested in Starlink as a backup internet connection. I would be in shut_up_and_take_my_money.jpg territory if we could confirm it is easy to shut off and turn back on on demand. I'd be more than happy to pay for a full month of service anytime I need it if my primary connection goes down. My hope is I can have it shut off 10 to 11 months of the year and then if a bad storm comes, all I have to do is get on their website on my phone, push a button, and bam my Starlink connection is active and they've charged me $100. No brainer.
    Click to expand...

    With their limited ability to serve geographical areas, that's probably not going to happen for quite awhile, possibly never. If you discontinue service, that frees up a slot for someone else, and once they grab it, they're not going to let it go. Only once SpaceX has enough satellites up to have constant spare capacity in your area would they even consider intermittent service. And, since it would be hard to explain to people in downtown New York why they couldn't sign up for just a month instantly, when Joe in Outer Slobovia can do that just fine, they might not do it for anyone.

    They're trying to put up more shells; with enough birds up there, the dynamic could change. But I don't think that's a market they'll actively chase.
     
    malor

    malor

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  • #38
    Kethinov said:
    I thought the shortage and delays were related to the chip shortage for manufacturing dishes, not network capacity. Is that not the case?
    Click to expand...

    That's above and beyond the simple geographical limits. They simply cannot serve very many people in any given square mile of land. They can serve almost any populated square mile on Earth, but not densely.

    Even if chip supplies were unlimited, service slots in urban areas would be scarce. More shells will help that, but that's probably not going to happen until after Starship is flying, assuming that it does.
     
    G

    gusgizmo

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  • #39
    https://satellitemap.space/

    Looking at a map of their ground stations helps put things into perspective quickly.

    From reading the FCC filings, each base station has 8 antennas. Extrapolating, each ground station can serve seven 200km wide hexagonally shaped coverage areas. My understanding is that they lock the transceivers to a coverage area and restrict the number they issue to each area.
     
    Paladin

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  • #40
    nick_rrr said:
    I read a bunch of comments on the topic of starlink and was a little amazed at how people developed technologies so much after the launch of the first satellite that the Internet from space can literally be possible and accessible. It really strikes the imagination and makes you wonder what else people are capable of? :cool: :cool:
    Click to expand...

    Future spam account in training? ^^^ Or legit? :/ :rolleyes:
     
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