Apple is reportedly shifting its next Vision headset to a cheaper model
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They are attacking a market early, that has seen other failed entries in some form or another, and some of their moves are great. However, they made a pretty movie screen that still isn't great at what it's supposed to do.
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I would be very interested if Apple can make a VR headset that is much lighter (That looks like a regular glasses or skii goggles), and can act as a high quality display for Mac, iPad, iPhone and Apple TV for less than 1000 CAD.
It doesn't need to run apps or AI, just needs to be a good secondary display that I can carry around. Would be even better if it can accept signals from PS5 and Switch (But this won't happen with Apple of course)
Basically I want an Apple branded display in the form of a glasses that I can carry around.
It doesn't need to run apps or AI, just needs to be a good secondary display that I can carry around. Would be even better if it can accept signals from PS5 and Switch (But this won't happen with Apple of course)
Basically I want an Apple branded display in the form of a glasses that I can carry around.
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.Even if true, this doesn’t sound like shifting priorities. They released a high-end pro model as their first model, and are working on a more consumer-level model using the lessons learned. They'll probably then have a new pro level model afterwards.
Standard practice for entering a new developing market.
Standard practice for entering a new developing market.
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If this report can be believed, then it suggests sales of the Vision Pro are likely below expectations. Which would not be surprising for a very expensive device without a compelling use case at this time.
A cheaper model is a good direction to go - though $1600 is still well over that of a Quest Pro. I guess the important thing here is that Apple is still planning to continue supporting the device. Looking at you, Sony.
A cheaper model is a good direction to go - though $1600 is still well over that of a Quest Pro. I guess the important thing here is that Apple is still planning to continue supporting the device. Looking at you, Sony.
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I'm still not sure what these are supposed to be FOR.
Everyone talks about VR, but all the demos are more of an augmented reality type system.
VR has been stuck in the mud progress / adoption wise for a while.
Augmented reality type systems have similarly found limited appeal.
Still I'm all for the experiment.
Everyone talks about VR, but all the demos are more of an augmented reality type system.
VR has been stuck in the mud progress / adoption wise for a while.
Augmented reality type systems have similarly found limited appeal.
Still I'm all for the experiment.
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The starting price is 5000 Canadian dollars.
Yeah.. no.
The front facing display is something that can easily be eliminated.. the creepy eyes don’t seem to add any value whatsoever.
Yeah.. no.
The front facing display is something that can easily be eliminated.. the creepy eyes don’t seem to add any value whatsoever.
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Yes, it does, because the sources are not saying that 'Apple is releasing a lower end headset', they're saying that 'Apple is shifting their priorities to only build a lower end headset instead of a lower end one in addition to the pro like they had been doing'.
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The fact Apple have the word “Pro” in the name of the current headset indicates there is and/or was a plan for a standard Vision non-Pro headset.
End of 2025 makes sense. Give Apple time to reduce costs of the SoC and improve and enhance the software. Also gives them a little time to nail down the hardware for a standard headset while meeting the expectations of the users. Maybe they will keep the screens, but cheap out in other places. \(ツ)/¯
But really, I don’t know if I trust the source. Anybody could be spitting out rumors that sound logical based on information that’s publicly available.
End of 2025 makes sense. Give Apple time to reduce costs of the SoC and improve and enhance the software. Also gives them a little time to nail down the hardware for a standard headset while meeting the expectations of the users. Maybe they will keep the screens, but cheap out in other places. \(ツ)/¯
But really, I don’t know if I trust the source. Anybody could be spitting out rumors that sound logical based on information that’s publicly available.
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If I was ever forced to work back in an open plan office with people moving and having conversations all around me I might mandate that my employer buy me a Vision Pro (or Quest Pro or whatever) for working on/in.
That being said, for most people/jobs, I feel like it doesn't take that much more negotiating power to negotiate remote work instead.
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If Vision Pro can function as a high rez screen for creative professionals, its price doesn’t have to drop below $2,000 USD to be a significant success. There are millions of graphics professionals using 5K displays, 6K displays, and even multiple 5K/6K displays that they’ve invested at least $2,000 in.
The market is there. The problem is whether the current Vision Pro is an adequate replacement for their large monitors. Even if Resolution might be good enough for some, are they willing to accept the ergonomics of wearing a large headset on their head for hours?
If they are balking at ergonomic factors, Apple has to address those along with (or even before) improving resolution.
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Honestly, the hands down most compelling use case I've seen for Vision Pro is in travel mode on a train or airplane, but I've heard that it's pretty limited by it's gesture navigation in that scenario compared to Quest's more discrete and reliable controllers.
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While your monitor doesn't follow you around, it also isn't limited by comfort on your head or battery life (or power cable streaming down your body - which then makes it a semi-portable/glorified monitor).
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I’d also be in the market for a “dumb” high end display with portability and battery life. Similar products exist already but they all have some combo of sacrifices - quality, comfort, tethered connection/power…
Likewise, I’d also spend money on simplified Apple AR platform that relied on an iPhone for processing. I struggle to understand why this wasn’t what Apple created in the first place - maybe concerns over a lackluster experience given the varying processing power and capabilities of the iPhone lineup? Seems obvious that a simplified AR device could be made cheaper and much more quick to drive adoption if it only required a user to set their iPhone 15/16 Pro into “AR mode” and connect. An entire separate computer on your face seems silly and redundant when a powerful new iPhone likely resides in the pocket of any Vision Pro buyer.
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I read a long article on the use of the Vision Pro for people with visual and aural handicaps yesterday, which may prove to be the first bona fide use case. My brother has severe retinal damage, and runs his laptop to a 27 inch monitor less than six inches in front of his face. I am wondering about a Vision Pro for his birthday, but he is a Windows man, and at our age only so much change is tolerable, and the Vision Pro is alarmingly throwable......
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This situation seems to be an echo of what happened at Apple in the 1980s when the company was building a successor to the Apple II. Most of the company created the Lisa, but Jobs created an outlaw team to create the Macintosh. The Lisa was way ahead of its time, but was also more expensive than a lot of cars. Looks like Apple is trying to find the Macintosh of augmented reality machines because the Vision Pro is is like the Lisa.
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I’m still waiting for a compelling use case. but then I waited for the iPhone 5, and Apple Watch 6 before I jumped into those. I’m still figuring 2030 is about when I’m going to find this a compelling product.
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I'm excited for when the vision headset is at a more accessible price point. If they are the price of an iphone I think it would still be an expensive toy, but a more realistic entry point for the masses. Maybe by generation 4 vision pro will be ready for the common person.
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I'm aware of the conclusion you wanted to reach dictating the logical leap you needed to make, but here in reality Apple has a history of pivoting or retargeting products.
The Apple Watch found little success as a fashion statement or as an app host and has pivoted to being a sports accessory.
The iPad's big launch push as the future of print media lasted about as long as The Daily.
The iPhone saw a 1/3 price drop only three months after launch, with the lower-capacity model dropped entirely.
The first iPod was Mac-exclusive and both the first and second generations required Firewire, making them unusable with an overwhelming majority of computers even if there was now technically a version of iTunes for Windows.
... and nobody mention the iPod Hifi. Or, especially, iTunes Ping.
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As a question, what exactly was the Vision Pro supposed to do?
I mean for every other device Apple has even a small child can immediately figure out what it is for.
The problem with the Vision Pro is that I can’t really see any reason why it is the first best method to accomplish any task.
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The use case I'm waiting for is an upgrade to Facetime that lets me see and talk to people as if they were actually there in the room with me, rather than just floating square-framed faces on a screen. I'm not rich, but something like that would have me splashing on out on several for family members that I can hardly ever see in person.
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As a price comparison, I’ve been looking at getting a new 32” monitor. It’s mostly for coding so I’d like a high PPI and contrast for sharp text. 120hz support would be really nice, too.
Currently I’m leaning towards a 4K OLED which costs about €1500. A monitor arm adds another €100-150. So about the same price as this rumoured cheaper Apple vision headset (which obviously has a lot more tech inside and can do a lot more). If they can keep the perceived quality high, it could be in contention.
I might have even considered the full-price Vision Pro if they could make it comfortable enough for long viewing sessions. The ability to create a virtual screen of any size/aspect ratio is a very compelling proposition.
Currently I’m leaning towards a 4K OLED which costs about €1500. A monitor arm adds another €100-150. So about the same price as this rumoured cheaper Apple vision headset (which obviously has a lot more tech inside and can do a lot more). If they can keep the perceived quality high, it could be in contention.
I might have even considered the full-price Vision Pro if they could make it comfortable enough for long viewing sessions. The ability to create a virtual screen of any size/aspect ratio is a very compelling proposition.
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I bought the original Oculus Rift DK1 when they had a Kickstarter in 2012 for $300. I think I received it in 2013. It was really neat. I did the island demo, rode the rollercoasters, and played some of the early games. Friends and family had a fun time as well. I sold it after the novelty wore off and have never had the urge to buy another newer headset. While it had silk screening and a bit of lag, it gave me a feel of what VR could be. Fun, but kind of that laser tag/3D movies/motion simulator fun that is novel to experience a few times but isn’t so revolutionary that it finds its way into my daily routines. I get why some gamers would enjoy it regularly though!
I’ve tried newer VR tech along the way and it keeps getting better but the core uses just do not vibe with me and it seems it doesn’t vibe with most people. I really don’t think it’s a matter of this still being an emerging market, I think most people don’t care enough to strap something to their face no matter the price or feature set.
Maybe some killer feature will come out that makes me want one but we are a decade in with all the big players involved and billions spent without anyone breaking through to the mainstream. So I’m not so sure bringing it down from $3500 to $1600 will do much without Apple figuring out a reason for people to buy one in the first place.
I’ve tried newer VR tech along the way and it keeps getting better but the core uses just do not vibe with me and it seems it doesn’t vibe with most people. I really don’t think it’s a matter of this still being an emerging market, I think most people don’t care enough to strap something to their face no matter the price or feature set.
Maybe some killer feature will come out that makes me want one but we are a decade in with all the big players involved and billions spent without anyone breaking through to the mainstream. So I’m not so sure bringing it down from $3500 to $1600 will do much without Apple figuring out a reason for people to buy one in the first place.
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That’s what I find to be the biggest weakness of the concept. It’s very isolating.Sure that’s fine if you’re working alone in an office. But they keep saying this is to watch TV and movies with. For a lot that is a social thing, and even at $1600 getting one for every member of the family, vs a good big LCD TV is a no brainer. I just don’t see the form factor as being a winner. Maybe the next gen won’t look like ski goggles, but it’s still more intrusive than nothing. And nothing is what most people use to watch TV or movies at home.
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It's unfortunate that the most expensive part of any VR headset is the most critical one. A budget vision pro with lower quality screens is no longer an attractive proposition as a monitor replacement. What VR needs to become practical is a revolution in display manufacturing to bring down the cost of high-PPI displays.
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As the "Pro" in the name suggests, most of the use cases are at work.
Manufacturing is the big one, where VR and AR are very useful for visualizing those CAD models.
Training people for manual tasks is another. For example, learning how to do surgery could be made a lot more effective with the right AR app.
Logistics is being proposed as another use case, where AR could make warehouse workers more efficient.
The consumer entertainment stuff seems like a long shot to try and bulk up the sales numbers.
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Maybe this is a generational thing; I don't anyone that watches TV with other people. Everyone's on their own screen watching their own thing. AR would be a logical next step.
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In regard to cutting costs, my first thought would be to remove the outer screen that they use to show the eyes. It might be better in the future, but as of right now, it was probably the most unremarkable part of most Vision Pro videos that I watched, and I can't imagine that a curved screen like that is particularly cheap.
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I honestly don’t see a cost reduced version of the Vision Pro working without the same screen resolution. Same goes for the eye tracking and passthru cameras. The only areas I can think of they could skimp on would be dropping exterior display and going with cheaper build materials like plastic. Both of those would also likely decrease weight which could be nice as well.
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From what I've read, It seems long term fatigue (due to weight) is still an issue when using it for extended periods. (compared to other headsets).
I wonder if this will ultimately be solved and how? (regardless of if Apple does it or someone else.)
I'm not against AR/VR headsets. I own a Valve Index and have owned others before that. The weight ends up getting to me personally. I was hoping this was solved with the Vision Pro, but apparently not, at least from the reviews I've watched/read.
There is definitely room for display quality to go down, but I hope they stick with OLED and high refresh rate.
The iOS/Vision OS lock-in and lack of an "open" platform doesn't help either. They should be adventurous and add SteamVR support or something.
I wonder if this will ultimately be solved and how? (regardless of if Apple does it or someone else.)
I'm not against AR/VR headsets. I own a Valve Index and have owned others before that. The weight ends up getting to me personally. I was hoping this was solved with the Vision Pro, but apparently not, at least from the reviews I've watched/read.
There is definitely room for display quality to go down, but I hope they stick with OLED and high refresh rate.
The iOS/Vision OS lock-in and lack of an "open" platform doesn't help either. They should be adventurous and add SteamVR support or something.
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This is dumb if true. They need to release at least one, but preferably two more headsets at the bleeding edge of VR/AR. Only then should they find a middle ground. They will lose millions and millions before they become profitable, but their tech will be leagues ahead of everyone else, and hopefully their software will be refined by then to make for a truly desirable piece of tech.
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What big things do people wear on their heads all the time?
Hats. Helmets.
Helmets. I’m not suggesting Apple makes a motorbike helmet version of the Vision Pro, but some companies and sectors have literally a century of experience of making modern strong heavy helmets as light and comfortable and well balanced as possible.
Apple could learn a lot about balance and weight distribution and comfort from helmet makers and hat makers.
People wear helmets 12 hours a day, admittedly often because they’ll be sacked or arrested if they don’t, but for some helmet wearers money is little object as long as the helmet is comfortable.
Again I’m not suggesting Apple makes a chrome dome version of the Vision Pro, but some kind of rig that sits on / around the head and carries the goggles as lightly and well balanced as possible - and stays comfortable all day long - should be possible.
I’ve seen VR mods that involve attaching a battery to the back of the headband. That some people favour such a thing shows that lightness isn’t everything, balance and weight distribution also count for a lot.
Hats. Helmets.
Helmets. I’m not suggesting Apple makes a motorbike helmet version of the Vision Pro, but some companies and sectors have literally a century of experience of making modern strong heavy helmets as light and comfortable and well balanced as possible.
Apple could learn a lot about balance and weight distribution and comfort from helmet makers and hat makers.
People wear helmets 12 hours a day, admittedly often because they’ll be sacked or arrested if they don’t, but for some helmet wearers money is little object as long as the helmet is comfortable.
Again I’m not suggesting Apple makes a chrome dome version of the Vision Pro, but some kind of rig that sits on / around the head and carries the goggles as lightly and well balanced as possible - and stays comfortable all day long - should be possible.
I’ve seen VR mods that involve attaching a battery to the back of the headband. That some people favour such a thing shows that lightness isn’t everything, balance and weight distribution also count for a lot.
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